Hey you guys, I rarely start my own threads, but I think this one is necessary. I was thinking that since Clark foam is no longer making that little green planer that a lot of us have love/hate relationships with- We as a group could come up with an “open source” method for building a “Shapers planer.” By Shapers planer I mean one that you can rapidly open and close the depth on the fly while shaping, the way the Clark modified Hitachi and the Skil 100 worked. I was thinking about dissecting one of my Hitachis… Anybody interested? Maybe figure out how/where to get all the parts and make a sort of how-to to reproduce the Clark planers that we could dump into the Resources? -Carl
good idea…
even with the skil 100 you have to take it apart and remove a piece.
a day or so ago someone talked about how they did it with a Bosch…
I would be glad to help! From what I’ve read in the past the key to the planer is getting the threaded insert. Making one is expensive but if enough people were interested then they could be bought in bulk.
Do it Carl!
Those stock planers go for about 100 on ebay. that would save us alot of $$$ if we bought the premodified one. If we could get our hands on one nowadays…
Rio
a careful read of this might be a starting point.
You can get the Hitachis new at lowes for 90.00 I think or order it with the case for 100.00
It should be easy to figure out, I have 4 hitachis 1 old Clark, 1 new clark and 2 regulars as backups. As long as you have both planers you shoul be able to get it all set.
http://www.mcmastercarr.has all the parts you need.
Funny thing is clark has a ton of the conversion kits, I wonder whats become of them.
I can dissect PC’s but not planers . . . go for it if you have some electrical knowledge . . . I was taken back by the planer expense . . .
Maybe try it with stock planer and see if you could do the clark-esque mods on it. There are lot of machining guys here.
seabaseuk has the clark planer still for sale: http://www.seabase.ltd.uk/
I’m assuming they have the parts since clarks webpage links to them . . . But yeah but a clark hitachi for $320 us?? nuts
Here’s another way:
Get shaper’s input on what they like about a planer. Catalog it in a database. Seperate it into several catagories like a heavy planer for wood boards, production style light foam planer, and inbetween for DIY’s or what not. Then get a team of shapers to form a crew that will test out the prototype planer ready.
Then pick a great tool company that makes a great planer and have a industry professional approach them with shapers specs, and ask them to design a new planer specifically for surfboard shaping. Get some people to draw up plans and budget for R&D, production cost, time lines etc . . . Once the financial outlays are worked up, it will be the job of all of us to find shapers willing to buy that planer. The amount of planers purchased will have to cover the financial outlay and offer some profit to the company.
Then they can build it, they won’t have to worry because they have a customer list waiting that will cover expenses, while having engineers and shapers work closely to build a working planer specifically for mowing wood or foam for surfboards. Possibly have some of the surf industry moguls get in on this.
Hiro,
The smart part of that really is OUR modified planers work just as well for Regular duty apps. So if a tool company agreed then they could sell those everywhere home depot lowes etc as just a redesigned version they kill 2 birds with 1 stone.
A couple of things to consider:
The Skil, even modified, or the Clark-modified Hitachi, isn’t the be-all and end-all of shaping planers, instead it’s a modification of something made for woodworking and fixed or set cut depth work. The on-the-fly depth adjustments on those two are kind of a kludged-together thing.
What about a planer with depth control as part of the forward knob/handgrip? Either that twists or maybe a lever that behaves something like a brake lever on a bike? Or a thumb-operated control? Lots of better options than the Skil or the Hitachi/Clark setup.
Also- rather than trying to get the big toolmakers to come up with a new tool, what about a small production run of ‘planer kits’ - I say kits rather than finished planers so that the manufacturer would be protected from some liability issues and thus more encouraged to do the work.
Rather than plastic-bodied injection molded cr@p for a small production run, it may well be ( TomatDaum, what do you think?) that some investment-cast aluminum bodies and shoes could be made economically that’d work just fine, maybe include the electrical guts of a cheap plastic plane or a router or laminate trimmer but in a planer body that had some good ergonometrics and the like to it. Designing it around that would certainly be a lot cheaper than, say, coming up with the armature design and such and having that made too. Toothed belt drive and there you are.
The nice thing about investment casting is that it can be done with tremendous accuracy, something can be cast that is within tolerances to use as is, without any major machining beyond maybe tapping some threads and the like. Could work out rather nice.
anyhow- just tossing some blue-sky ideas into the mix…
doc…
I forgot about Tom,
Tom if you read this, how hard would it be to make the post thats inside the clark planers for a limited run
-what do you guys think about those spiraling blades? (what are they called again?) I know it might be overkilll but there was some talk awhile ago about machining something to fit the clark/hitachi.
-I agree with doc, maybe making something from scratch might be more cost effective?
Rio
There are plenty of options out there.
Hitachi still makes the P20SB. So parts will be around for ages.
You can pick a brand new one up on ebay for less the 100.00 from time to time.
Or maybe build your own from the brand of your chioce.
At present we are looking into refitting a Makita 4 3/8" planer.
Something to back up our “DINA”
THE DINA
4’x1/4"x1/4" horse
Hey, Rio -
Helical blades, and if you were going from scratch with nothing more than an armature, then perhaps a shaft that was set up to deal with those ( rather than a cutterhead holding X number of cutters ) might be a move, easier than fabricating the cutterhead.
I think such blades or blade setups are available off-the-shelf ( shell mills, spiral type) in high speed steel, carbide and as a kind of drum with carbide inserts, for machining metals. Though they are probably rated for lower speeds than you’d want to be turning in a planer. Or, could be made to work with those abrasive drums that are relatively ( though not cheaply) available for the Skil and others.
This gets interesting, no?
Also- while the standard front shoe is straight and paralell with the rear shoe ( for planing wood flat ) nobody says it would have to be for a surfboard planer. Say, something with a bit of upward curve to it?
this is kinda fun…
doc…
Quote:
or maybe a lever that behaves something like a brake lever on a bike
That is one of the best ideas I’ve heard. Take the on/off switch off the handle and replace it with a depth adjustable hand break. It would be so easy to use. If only I knew where to start on such a project!
Quote:
Quote:or maybe a lever that behaves something like a brake lever on a bike
That is one of the best ideas I’ve heard. Take the on/off switch off the handle and replace it with a depth adjustable hand break. It would be so easy to use. If only I knew where to start on such a project!
Hmmm… I was skeptical at first, because of my natural tendency to go with what I know- the control on the front of the planer- but now my mind is whirring- I’m thinking it could be spring loaded- with a cable… gotta go sketch this out- good stuff guys! -Carl
what if you had a multi speed trigger, but instead of controling the speed it controled the depth of the cut?
This is one of the things that make Swaylocks such a great site! People are interested in creating things. You rarely meet people who are interested in trying to make something exactly right when they can buy something that is sort of right.
Another thing that I’d like to see is proper dust collection. The opening should be large and centered like this one that rickholt did
-adjustable handles? so the planer’s handles aren’t set at only one angle. to suit different styles…and heights.
Some really interesting ideas here. I was involved in the designing of the 2003 Clark planer. There were several objectives that constrained the choices for the base model from which the new planer was built.
The most difficult part to build will be the “donut” as it was called, which is just below the rubber twist handle. This controlled the action of the new planer. I am starting to think shapers did not know just how adjustable the “feel” of the new planer was and would just “get used to it” as it came out of the box.
The second important aspect was the geometry of the rear handle and the safety issue when a worker lets go of the front handle during operation (the over-the-top connection of the rear handle to the planer body). Geometry changes were made to get away from the “ironing” action which only promoted down pressure, and to make more of a ‘trueing action’ where the rear wrist can have more rotational (left/right roll) contol. The 2003 Hitachi was intended to be used primarily with a vacuum set-up and the vacuum provided adequate down force to the part.
Many planers were considered, in fact more than 20 kinds. I couldn’t believe some of the planers Clark got his hands on. A top candidate that was passed only because of price was the Bosch unit. The Bosch still has a plastic body but the quality of the plastic is superior and this means the bearing lands hold the rotating parts with more precision (less vibration) and the bearing pockets were much less likely to let a bearing spin and melt out or wobble and wear prematurely.
The big costs for Clark were the custom-machined helical drives and the donut of the front handle. In the wake of the blank crisis, my discussions with him 3 years ago led me to believe he was very concerned about the “low numbers shaper” having a quality tool that was within a reasonble budget. He said this was one of his “projects” he really wanted to get out there.
He did this and other projects as a way to counter the increase in machine shaping and the growing import market. He told me that he truly believed the small-time surfboard builder had more to offer than any production line. “Custom, made in a garage, or a shed”. You probably wouldn’t think it with the latest events; I know he must have suffered terribly with the complete loss of his company; he hung on as long as anyone ever, possibly could. The general public will never know this.
Hi Doc,
Check out the Festool planer… www.festoolusa.com/ProductDetails.aspx?id=5&prodid=574539#
I haven’t tried this one, but the adjustment is on the handle and it has a single spiral blade. The company uses independent rep’s who will come to you and let you try it.