"The Burger" Bert Berger Tribute!

General Discussion
41

yep Good luck bert hope it works out for you … dont forget to head up to the sunshine coast to, it may be a bit less crowded. also check out North Strabroke Island… Funny thing about the goldie is that there are heaps of uncrowded waves to be had just a short drive south… of the border . Thanks for your amazing posts hope you will still be posting here fora while yet … IM totally hooked, Just about to?@glass the bottom of my first balsa sandwich board and im a amazed at how light the blank is … Im really happy so far … Thanks Again Mate

Paul Cannon

42

As this is a tribute to Bert and his inspiration here’s a pic of a board I just laminated today. It had been sitting around in the shed unshaped for about 6 months, I bagged the balsa on it last year then got busy doing other things. filler coat tomorrow hmm might get it finished in another 6 months.

43

hey dan , i will wait till things have developed a little more , id love to start talking about some of the stuff were up to , but im not just dealing with my own welfare anymore …

yes im working with others , once things are rolling , then i could start making official statements , but wouldnt do so on swaylocks , as it wouldnt be the place to make commercials …

still alot of intensive R&D going on , so the final picture cant be stated exactly …

and yes , to be honest , my time here is reduced , just lucky those 1050 posts have turned me into a typing machine …

jip , that was a surprise , about how many posts …

i had to laugh hicksy , definatly still on earth , not chasing dreams tho , more like trying something different …

dont forget to post some pics silly…

hey mike , is that the one with end grain balsa rails ??

should be good for triggs …

ken !, can i expect waves like those photos consistently on the east side ??

ok now that we all know each other , hows those boards coming on josh and steve ???

any update pics yet …

also ken , serious question …

im assuming your not working for some of the crew you mentioned earlier because of shaping machines ??

its sounds like youve been around longer than machines have , so that probably means you were machining and shaping start to finish …

do you do everything on a board , glass , sand ,etc or just specialise in shaping ??

hope speedy doesnt mind here , that we hijacked his thread and all …

why i ask , because the machine has changed the numbers in the industry …

it used to take 3 or 4 shapers to keep up with one glasser , but now it takes 3 glassers to keep up with one shaper and a machine …

while all that has happened the importance of some rolls have changed …

when i first started , the shapers made all the money , but now with machines , the glassers and sanders have become more important because of the skill needed …

everyone i know is struggling to find good glassers and sanders , even rusty shut down and moved east coz of a serious shortage of craftsmen …

so my original question is , is it the same on that side ??

why would the factories be full of kids ??

i have heard comments like , theres all these ex ghost shapers that wont touch a sander even tho they could make more money doing it …

i have no problem picking up whatever tool it takes to get the job done…

after hearing comments like that , maybe its a matter of breaking down the traditional pecking order within the factory …

i know guys who have left the industry rather than pick up a sander …

i helped a guy out a few years back who had a container to fill and he needed a sander urgently , i was making 500 a day just sanding surfboards …

is that the case with you??

i sense a slightly bitter attitude toward the industry in general …

would you feel that leaving shaping for another facet of construction would be like demotion ??

just curious as to what your story is and why you presented harshly to the way it is …

gumby , did i miss you one afternoon coz i was off doing something else , while you were checking out those boards …

coz he told me that so and so came over but man am i straining my brain to remember who it was …

it will come to me , and no doubt we will catch up in the future …

addressing more or your drive question …

when using spring to achieve drive and squirt its reletive to how much you load it …

when i set up a board , i consider the weight of the rider , but also the power level of the surfer plays a role …

using the archery bow as an example …

if you hand a child a bow , he wont get the same distance because he couldnt load it as far …

if your style of surfing is more static and you ride the wave , then static shape properties have more influence , the more agressively you can load your board the more you get out …

seriously there are so many facets to the whole equation , needless to say , those boards were built for low weight but high loads with more of a focus on movement from the surfer …

regards

BERT

44

Hey Ken, if those are current pics I see you still rip. I remember when you moved north years ago, like Dozza did more recently.

Being an ex PI boardmaker, I got most of my work making other peoples boards. It was a good source for money, and materials, to support my habit back then.

Ends up I didn’t have the ego, or the motivation, to challenge the world of boardmaking. I just wanted to surf, travel, and make good boards for myself, and anyone else who wanted one.

The glassers, sanders and ding fixers, usually the same person a lot of the time, were the ones who were hard core, I could name several. They wanted better boards.

I’ve been out of the pro boardmaking scene for some time, dabbling in other composite work. So when Bert showed up here explaining his act, I was interested. Like a lot of people, I could see that his techniques were challenging, to say the least.

If I were on or near the Gold Coast, I would be hurriedly scribbling down my resume on the back of a bit of worn out sandpaper, in the hope that I could be part of what is an inevitable forward leap in boardmaking.

Bert, you have made it quite clear to people who are willing to listen and understand, that the design change necessary to keep up with the materials and manufacturing is something that should not be ignored.

I’m now hundreds of miles inland now, but my instinct tells me to make something new. The strength, flex and weight equation is something I have to try.

My wife knows we will eventually heading to the coast somewhere, so when this board gets made I can see it getting towed by kite or boat till it eventually hits some waves.

In the vein of this thread, I also pay some tribute to Bert for being so open. To the people out there who are feeling a bit threatened by progress, my advice is to jump on it, or run away. The earlier you do either, the better off you will be.

And my name and details are in my profile, unlike many others here who have a problem in accepting who they are and where they are in the world.

45

Hey Bert

I was one of the lucky shapers to actually start shaping in the single fin era, so yes, you could say that I have shaped from start to finish.

Yes I can do the easy part of surfboard production (glass,sand,polish, basicaly like you said any kid can do that) but my main goal has always been to learn as much about the actual shape and fins of the board.

I am lucky enough to have a clientel of riders from the Goldy to Victoria that help support my learning addiction.

I dont go and get a sanding job because

  1. I dont need to (thank god)

  2. you could’nt pay me enough to suck down silicon and dust everyday

  3. I am not an ex ghost shaper, I just chose not to work for those peolpe who I believe dont really give a shit about advancing surfboard design for the want of making a better board. It’s the money and glory for them.

Good to hear that you are prepared to sand though because once they suck your brain you can come and see me because we are always looking for good sanders.

(Although Nev won’t let you get away that easily)

is that the case with you??

i sense a slightly bitter attitude toward the industry in general …

would you feel that leaving shaping for another facet of construction would be like demotion ??

Dont make me laugh, these days a demotion is being a ghost shaper, they make less than a sander over here.

These guys are trying to put an end to anyone else coming into the industry and learn the craft of shaping.

Scared Control freaks!!!

As for them being so far advanced that we should be scared of what they are going to do, stop it, my insides are hurting from laughing. You forget that I know all of these guys and have done for the last twenty years.

They chase each others tails and pinch each others curves, hence my statement to the reasoning of why boards have’nt changed in the last 10 or more years.

Maybe you will give them new fuel to make more money but dont expect to get any great revalations from them towards desgning.

I too have some great toys

My computer machine that I researched and designed the holdown system for cost all up $30,000au and can produce the same quality as the ones that are on the market for $80,000+.

I can design, machine and shape 10 boards in just over half a days work.

Yeah I have some ideas that i believe could be ground breaking aswell, purely through the advancement in CNC cadcam.

I am not saying that it is a race, I am merely saying that i would rather work on my own than work with people who are doing it for the wrong reason.

I can see alot of consistencies between you and me Bert and that was why I was quick to jump in on your move over here.

I would like to meet you and show you what i am doing, that is if your new partners let you.

You can see more of what I am about on my msn photo site.

http://groups.msn.com/MyKRSurf/_whatsnew.msnw

regards

Ken

46

Bert, I’ve shaped the deck of mine and ready for Corecell skin.

At all times I’ve tried to consider how the work could be emulated by machine:- A ShopBot would have cut those rail stringers in a flash!

I’ve got the hang of APS 3000 and Stephen and I had a couple of normal preshapes from it:- I remember seeing a post - you asking questions Miki would’nt answer at the time!

Combine the shaping machine with a hotwire cutter and the only hand labour would be in laminating /Bagging.

But I’d be guessing this is where you are going.

But a more immediate swaylocker question:-

I’ve gotta work out how to put oil BACK INTO my fridge pump! It’s been going along faithfully for extra long baggings in the Victorian winter, but its starting to make gurgling noises!?

I realise you may now be restrained from answering certain Swaylocks questions:- I respect that.

I’ve been into the idea of digitally printed sprays…Aspects of bagging technique make this infinitely easier.

47

Sorry bert I know that it is a tribute to you but i forgot to answer Wildy.

Hey Wildy long time no see, I saw the name Wildy a couple of times in the threads and thought of you but the addy was wrong, i thought that being an American address that the PI stood or private investigator.(laugh)

I hope all is well and that you do make it back to the coastline ASAP.

Mick Clarke says G’Day and wishes you well, he just got married but i guess that you knew that.

Yeah those pics where taken on a trip to the Maldives in 2001, had a great time with my brother and some friends. Thirty seven and I felt like a grom, aah the Maldives, what a place to go surfing for the fun of it. Cant wait to get back there.

Sorry again bert but I did forget to mention that there are some board makers here that are cool and that I do have respect for. Some of them are probably not as well known as the magazine shapers but I do know that they love what they do and are very good at it.

Wayne Deane

Neal Purchase senior and junior

Nic Maz

Brendan Milch

Daryl Bulger

Craig Maddison

Geoff Darby

Dominic Wybrow

Tony Elthrington

Lance Murphy

Stuart Smith

Noddy

Ian Burn

Hoksey

and even after working for Rod Dahlberg for 6 years and him chosing to go with the big boys at BASE, I still respect him as a shaper. ( he too was offered what he thought the right career decision, yep yep yep)

Unfortunately some of these guys are not in the positions that they should be but none the less are well deserving of their contribution to Queensland surfboard history.

So yeah Bert, it aint all bad, and every now and again you might get a solitary surf on a beachy before the highrise crew see you.

Watch out for poker faces and play your cards close to your chest, as this is a mini vagas, because you are only as good as the bluff you call or the royal flush that you hold.

regards

Ken

48

well ken , after checking out the link , i can say you will be a valuable contributor to this site …

Quote:

Dont make me laugh, these days a demotion is being a ghost shaper, they make less than a sander over here.

that was my point , you just made it real clear …

takes way more skill to take a board back to its intended shape , with a sander and sandpaper working on resin and glass than it does to just round the rails on a piece of urethane foam …

a sander deserves more for his highly skilled input …(thats planning ahead for when i come to sand for you) not

yep no problem , i can see exactly where your at and yea , look forward to meeting up in the future …

judging by your comments your just a little older than me , my first shape was a single and in my first job, singles and twinnies still accounted for over 50% of the work …

as far as design revelations ???

i dont mean to sound like a know it all , even tho it probably comes out that way sometimes , ive spent my whole life surfing a coastline that stretches from granite ledged south coast mutants with one eye and 5 lips, to southwest limestone bottomed solidness , midwest outer island and inner coastal florida style gutless mush to indo style coral points that get real west coast swells hitting them …

i hardly think im going to pick up any design revelations up there , when even my smallest wave groveler for knee to waist high , still works in double head QLD …

seriously my biggest challenge is building boards for lips that change there mind …

but on a real serious note , i could make you 5 identical boards and they will all go different based on energy transfer speeds and flex …

so your absolutly right im not expecting any grand design revelations …

had enough of them surfing a huge range of sizes, conditions and powers over here …

ive gone past static shape … its all about , structure , load , transfer ,spring…

you cant copy that in a hurry , its not like stealing someones curves , you think crew will be making our boards as quick as you can copy an outline ?

i had guys who worked for me 7 years and i still couldnt get them to under stand the basics and build them right…

what i do expect to learn over there is not how to build good boards , but how to do good business …

and i really am stoked with the revalations in those areas…

even tho the place is like you say , its extremely competitive business wise , and there are plenty of professional people who have an act …

when i was younger i learnt alot from respected shapers , but there is more to doing well in this industry than just shaping good boards …

dealing with respected businessmen is just like dealing with respected shapers when you were a grom , you pick up a lot just from watching how its done …

doesnt it make you wonder why some guys do so well when there boards are ??

im getting paid to get my brain sucked , but dont think im not soaking up valuable knowledge in return …

it works both ways …

you get the simons and the randy’s , the greenoughs and the merricks …

be interesting if you got them all together ??

good boards and good business …

yea speedy , your brain is ticking …

long day for me im out …

regards

BERT

49

Anybody who’s noiced the boards I’m working on knows how much I owe to Bert. Obviously, thanks bro. Good luck and don’t forget about us little guys. :slight_smile:

And yeah, KR, looks like you’re up to some interesting stuff too. Thanks for the link and I look forward to hearing more from you on here…

50

Hi Ken,

Its an interesting list of names you put down.

I remember Living Water and Zap labels from my involvement in Christian Surfers as a grommet. Nick and Dominic both got absorbed by Nev?

Thats an exceptional factory setup on your website, so neat you would be proud to have the rellies over!

51

I believe there was a few names left off the list:

Al Byrne

Dick Van Straalen

Erle Pederson

Hohenesee

Murray Bourton

Gordon Merchant

Bert, good move coming here to learn mate. As you said quite correctly there are better waves over there but you couldnt ask for a better test track to get your boards to a market or to get immediate response on high performance in high performance waves. Anyone who has ever watched a session at D’bah or Snapper or Burleigh would agree the standard of surfing here is phenomenal, if only there was less pubs, clubs, drugs, beer and women a few surfers would actually make it away from here.

No use being the greatest shaper that never was is there? (personal opinion of course, I am sure many Swaylockers would believe to have more than 5 orders a year is selling out???)

“If people spent half of the time that they spent whinging on doing something about it there would be nothing left to whinge about” Great quote, one of my fathers best lessons to me.

Thanks for providing the soap box.

52

Bert, good move coming here to learn mate.

now there’s an interesting comment…

you got me curious Gumby, what sort of things will he be learning?

53

People who are experts in their field learn the most by surrounding themselves and subjecting their ideas to challenge by others. Even other who are far less expert occasionally throw up a good idea - the hard part is keeping an open mind and sorting the wheat from the chaff.

54

Sorry Bert but at this stage of board manufacturing up here the shaper still has control over the end result. (I certainly hope that you put a bit more effort into your shaping than “just rolling the rails”)

Until the shape is completly machined by computer (and I mean completely)it is up to the finish shaper to control how the board is going to react., I have seen novice shapers completelty fuck a board just by pulling gause. Most of the boards produced by the numbers up here are still off profilers and I can give you 5 profiled shapes off the same rocker and finished by 5 different ghosties and you will have 5 completely different boards.(maybe this will be easier than you think)

QUOTE “but on a real serious note , i could make you 5 identical boards and they will all go different based on energy transfer speeds and flex …”

I know where you are heading with this and yeah it is the future, that is why I too have been working on my own. but if i do succeed with my theories and prac I certainly wont be giving it to any of the bread heads up here, I will give it to the guys who are willing to try something different no matter what their standard (the black sheep so to speak) I guess that I just cant handle the dictatorship that power and control of products brings.To me it just breeds stagnation and blocks out those hoping to think outside the square.

. I had an argument with Greg Webber one day about being a shaper, he told me that the only reason that I (being me)shape for is to be the number one shaper in the world. I argued that it might be his reason but it is not mine, I could’nt give a rats arse about being recognised as the worlds best shaper because to me there is no such claim. I have always said to myself that with all the different styles of surfers out there, that if i can please 80%+ you have a business and inspiration to achieve higher levels of accuracy.

Are you of the Webber belief of a shapers intentions, or is it just the money thing??? You sound as though you are into learning the business end of it over here , was business getting worse for you over there?? not enough work???

You talk about the business prowess of the guys in the industry up here and what you will learn, it’s all new money (not made through making surfboards)they have found sucker investers that beleive because surfing is so popular that they will make godzillions of easy dollars from making surfboards.(BASE as an example, Nev’s resurgence another) The thing about easy money is that it disapears just as quick as it appeared.

Luck and timming play a major factor in business up here, J.S didn’t have a cent to his name until the Dahlberg Japaneese conection where looking for someone new to push, they backed him with a new factory and team riders and hence a legend is born.

The only people that I have seen make good money out of surfboard building are the ones who where smart enough not to throw it back to the advertisers to reasure their ego, but to invest in real estate, usually where the advertisers put their easy money.

.(Ahh realestate the lucky money of the late ninties)

Last year I was excepted to go to university to study half a day five days a week to start a 6 year jouney to become a civil engineer, the

first six months of mathematics and alot of the modules where based on the princibles that you speak of. (not meaning to brag or anything but getting a couple of high destinctions at 40 years old is pretty uplifting, especially when you leave school at a year ten level.)

Like I said you are not on your own with your theories, its just a pitty that you were’nt comming over here on your own merit, because I would have been happier to have bumped into you before the design starved generation got a hold of you.

I too did not learn to surf here and gained most of my insight of boarding knowledge by surfing from Phillip Island to Cactus.

I know that you are not comming here to make a normal surfboard and I think that that is great, I am not scared however and am quite the opposite, because I too know that the future of surfboards is now about to change and if you do not have a CNC machine and the knowledge of how to use it then it is going to be hard to keep up. As far as materials and construction go to complement your designs, the internet has opened up the world to everybody and imitations unfortunately are not hard to aquire.Thats when your money men come into it, they pay the bill for the advertising to promote your product to hopefully make them money, then the immitators step in and copy your product but sell it at a cheaper price and the timming is perfect because the sheep are tired of seeing your name.

Then the immatators , because they are making better percentages than you then take a large amount of money from your money men, the money men freak out and pull the plug and go back to realestate. Thats my take on so called big business up here, just make sure you get your cut Bert before the next golden goose arrives.(no pun intended)

Yeah you are right Gumby I did leave AB’s name out (didn’t mean to) and I appolgise to him because he is a legend and a very deserving one.

Speedneedle, that was my old factory where I worked, the two new ones are awsome, I willpost some pics of my machines and factory setup soon. $17,000 was spent on the exhaust system alone for the two sanding bays, you can almost sand in there without a mask. Actually I think that the relo’s have already moved in.

Thanks for sharing your surfboard construction techiques Bert and for that I do tribute you (although I do have to buy myself a case of beer and take a few days off work too work out how you do it)and I am sure that your name will go down in the Gold Coasts hall of fame for making great surfboards. best of luck

regards

Ken

55
Quote:

QUOTE “but on a real serious note , i could make you 5 identical boards and they will all go different based on energy transfer speeds and flex …”

I know where you are heading with this and yeah it is the future, that is why I too have been working on my own. but if i do succeed with my theories and prac I certainly wont be giving it to any of the bread heads up here, I will give it to the guys who are willing to try something different no matter what their standard (the black sheep so to speak) I guess that I just cant handle the dictatorship that power and control of products brings.To me it just breeds stagnation and blocks out those hoping to think outside the square.

my sentiments exactly …

check my stuff , you will get a pleasant surprise …

give to the poor , but make those who can afford pay …

and yes , surfing does have a habit of taking and not giving back …

i heard the comment recently " theres only 2 ways you make money out of surfboards , royalties and selling real estate "

so i agree again …

Quote:

Are you of the Webber belief of a shapers intentions, or is it just the money thing??? You sound as though you are into learning the business end of it over here , was business getting worse for you over there?? not enough work???

quite the opposite …

4 out of every 5 people walk away coz they cant wait a year …

i havent wholesaled a board for nearly 2 years …

crew hear good things about my boards , then coz they cant get one , figure theyll go get a surftech coz there similar …

now that hurts …

for 6 or 7 years now , ive stuggled with demand …

thats where i was coming from when i said every second kid could glass or sand …

if you want to make a movie and need good actors , you wouldnt go to africa ??

youd go to hollywood where you have a concentration of actors …

we just dont have the qualified crew over here …

imagine the pain of turning 15 retailers away over a 3 year period , simply coz you couldnt service them , and then dropping another 15 who were regular clients coz you couldnt fill demand …(sorry guys)

i figured why sell a board to a shop , when guys are lined up for a year to buy them direct …

its not a money thing at all , its a desire to let more people have what they want …

id rather see more crew enjoying twang , than just the rich and famous …

i had 2 options , just keep putting the price up and make more for less .

but that puts them out of reach of most surfers , even at a grand for a shorty there up there , but still within reach …

i feel so sorry for so many crew who just ride junk and there surfing goes no where or even backwards …

but i cant help them coz i cant make enough boards …

QLD is the surfboard soaked capital of australia right?

so i figure it must be the surfboard maker soaked capital as well …

if i wanted to make money , i would stay where i am , i want to make a difference …

im sick of seeing kids get ripped …

quick story …

i see kids really try to save a for a new board , only to have it snap or completly self destruct within a year …

a young guy came in recently with one of my boards to trade , he was 20 , he got the board secondhand when he was 15 , it was a 2 year old ex team board , he paid 500 , i gave him 500 for the trade …

i sold it for 650… 7 years old …

he said in the same time he owned that board all his mates were churning through boards …

he was quite prepared to wait a year for a newy , just lucky i had something that suited him …

see where this is heading ???

Quote:

Like I said you are not on your own with your theories, its just a pitty that you were’nt comming over here on your own merit, because I would have been happier to have bumped into you before the design starved generation got a hold of you.

yea bummer ive got no merit …

maybe once the design starved generation get a decent feed i might get some merit??

also fully agree on the cnc …

and the imitators , no problem , ive already given them a leg up …

it will be nice to have some competition …

coz when crew feel you have an unfair advantage , they play dirty …

even tho it still wont quite be a level field , coz i will still have a 15 year head start …

but some homework should see you make up 10 at least …

to be honest , i would much rather be writing up offer documents and doing financial projections for a prospectus , instead of going year after year doing boards , only to watch companies like surftech and salomon spring up and make grand claims about how far ahead they are , and having to sit back and except it coz they have the resources to tell everyone …

i started at 19 with $2000 …unlike others , surfboards have paid my way …

if new money doesnt work behind this , then it wont be from my lack of ability to manage resources …

yes meecrafty , learning business …

i already know how to make surfboards …i know business to , but for me this is another level of business

ken , i havent worn a mask sanding for over 3 years , no dust gets above my waist …

i designed and built my own system …

300 bucks and about 3 days work …

and it has filters , so the air going through my factory actually gets cleaner …

so while i can relate fully to so much you say ken , my circumstances are a little different to the norm ,money wont entice me but learning will …

i had it pounded into me, literally, when i was a grom …

“your not here to make money , your here to learn a craft , once your the best at your craft , youll make money”

sadly the guy who punched me in the arm as he parroted that statement to me often , hes now passed away …

but its a valuable piece of advice that my old buddy twiggo left me with …

enjoy your job and do it well , theyll pay you what your worth …

theres a saying , " a man skilled in his work , will appear before kings"

its a proverb , dont know which one …?

im just doing what i enjoy , and if what i enjoy gets me a few trips here and there and i get to meet some interesting crew and learn some new things , well thats a bonus …

if you really want money and its what you desire , then you will take short cuts to get it …

i dont need money , waves are free …

funny , dont think there are any kings in surfing …

as far as ego is concerned , everyone has one , its like your dog , dont let other people feed it , or else it will look for other peoples interests and not your own …

i know my place in the line up …

theres still plenty of crew sitting deep , maybe a freak one might swing my way , and then i would have just got lucky ??? or maybe i saw it coming while the others were to busy hassling each other ??

to busy worrying about who rounds the rails off on a piece of foam the best , instead of engineering a surf craft to go better …

thats another big day …

regards

BERT

56

The sharks are circling and just waiting for the fresh meat to dip into their feeding pool.

Bert, do you really think a $1,000 price tag will keep anyone from dissecting your creative efforts, and cutting your 10 year lead to zero? How about a $10,000 price tag? The day you sell your first board into the shark den is the day they start to feed. And the figure is 10 percent, that’s all you have to change an idea to MAKE IT YOUR OWN.

The box IS the computer and CNC cutter. It was designed to control numbers and production NOT design other than by downloading, copying, cloning and pirating. It’s a device that was created to take our individuality away and assimilate us into another mass class - “computer designer”. Will anyone remember the countless boards that you made when the historians get through with the number crunching? There’ll just be a one liner about “the father of flex/spring.”

Rearranging the production schedule by computer or the curves by bezier handles on the screen is not surfboard design, it is only another tool to bring the production numbers up. Just as moving the fins around or putting them on the front or back of the board is only a sleight of hand card trick designed to take your mind off the fact that your greatest accomplishment is the exhaust system that lets you shape those boards that will ultimately become the landfill hill that will drive the real estate market ever higher and out of reach of the average surfer.

EXPLOITING new markets or self created markets or old tired markets is all about marketing and number crunching and moving products and new models and board meetings and shareholders and on and on.

Design or Engineer or Producer it’s all about NEW business and getting more people to work and spreading the money out a little more evenly so more of the workers get a better share of the corporate earnings. It’s really not about giving those that you turn away a shot at your attractively produced board, cause you didn’t start talking about flex and concave decks till when? I don’t think it was ten years ago. You just realized that you we’re on to a new marketing angle that put you out in front of the crowd more than the semi-bulletproof construction that you offer at a premium price point. Tribute or cover boy - Time magazine man of the year?

You know RTM molding is going to kick the industry in the ass again, and further erode the respected elders place in the line-up. What will the industry really be like? Will you need surfers to MAKE surfboards or even DESIGN them? Won’t the leading edge riders input be all you need to dial in the corporations latest numbers, and all the prototypes will just feed into the room where the product surveys are being completed by those that are happy with a couple of free shirts and a bar of wax.

It ain’t a pretty picture…

57

yeah blake i get it…but biz is biz and if you have a superior product, priced right they will come…just wanted to know if G was referring to tech…cuz if it aint broke dont fix it…yeah bert i know…biz…one of my faves…i told you once a long time ago…you cant wear all hats…your hat is R&D…let others throw it out there…they will come…

i’ve read a lot of case studies and i see some parallels here with other visionaries…its gotta start somewhere…

state-of-the-art, custom composites at moderate/high production with high quality…oops sounds a lot like an internal mission statement…

anyone doing this over on QLD…anywhere else in the world? someone’s got be first…any bets out there???

PS - very very interesting thread…were does he get all those metaphors…loving and hating ken’s comments…am i bi-polar or is ken?

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Quote:

Bert, do you really think a $1,000 price tag will keep anyone from dissecting your creative efforts, and cutting your 10 year lead to zero? How about a $10,000 price tag? The day you sell your first board into the shark den is the day they start to feed. And the figure is 10 percent, that’s all you have to change an idea to MAKE IT YOUR OWN.

$1,000(AU) peepshow:

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Hey Bert,

Congrats on your move, regardless of what else happens, access to some of the worlds best surfers is going take whatever you do to a new level. I’m kind of curious as to what the view of Swaylocks is in the great satan aka the Gold Coast.

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"You talk about the business prowess of the guys in the industry up here and what you will learn, it’s all new money (not made through making surfboards)they have found sucker investers that beleive because surfing is so popular that they will make godzillions of easy dollars from making surfboards.(BASE as an example, Nev’s resurgence another) The thing about easy money is that it disapears just as quick as it appeared. "

Kennys got that right…

There were replies suggesting that my anti-base sentiments were misguided.

That there is shareholder money behind it and therefore profit expectations unrealistic in surfboard manufacturing is the only basis for my comment.

Please note that there are of course legend personalities and craftsmen attached to base for which I have personal respect.

We’ve got a unique perspective on Base down here because of the demise of Maurice Cole’s involvement. There’s a story…