One thing I really like about this forum is that there's very little surfboard snobbery. Meaning, folks here tend to make and ride what they like, irrespective of current trends or peer pressure about what to ride. Things are not so everywhere.
On the other popular surfboard design forum a little while ago, someone actually called a 6'6" a "longboard" - somewhat tongue-in-cheek, mind you, but to make the point that tons of folks now are riding sub-6 foot boards when they were riding longer sticks a few years ago.
Having been away from surfing for 5-6 years, I returned last fall to find folks riding stuff that was unheard of 10 years ago (at least to me) like a 5'4" biscuit or 5'6" Fish. Pretty wild. I had spent the 5 years before my temporary departure on longboards (over 9 feet) so I wasn't too concerned about the trends.
I decided on my return to make a real blitz towards improving my skills and my physical conditioning. I bought a 6'10" to transition me down from the logs, then a 6'4" Fish. I shaped myself a 6'4" Flyer-style quad (19.5 x 2 5/8) that I like pretty well on better surf days. I've lost a lot of weight and become a much stronger paddler. It's now got me thinking.
At age 36, 165 pounds and 6 feet, what should/would I be shooting for in terms of volume? If I stop now, have I pushed myself enough? If I start compromising my wave-catching or section-making ability by not having enough volume, is that when to stop going smaller? Should I even care?
IMHO, it all boils down to doing what makes you happy. nothing more/less... it's just surfing.
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Just read through that - very informative. Good to see others with the same question(s) in mind.
On the one hand, I should be out on whatever is most fun for me. That varies depending on the waves, of course. I find volume helpful not only for wave catching (as pointed out in the thread), but also for speed and making sections.
On the other hand, who doesn't want to push themselves to improve, to be riding the latest and greatest, and to be viewed in the lineup as someone with the skill to ride a low-volume board well (which then results in you getting more waves?)
That’s one of the problems with surfing right there…
“to be riding the latest and greatest, and to be viewed in the lineup as someone with the skill to ride a low-volume board well (which then results in you getting more waves?)”
**Turning yourself into a performing seal for onlookers approval.
**
That's one of the problems with surfing right there....
"to be riding the latest and greatest, and to be viewed in the lineup as someone with the skill to ride a low-volume board well (which then results in you getting more waves?)"
Turning yourself into a performing seal for onlookers approval.
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It is a problem, and a reality in the lineups at least around here. But for some, I don't think approval enters the equation as much as the respect to be left alone on the better waves.
To use a simple example - blow the takeoff on a set wave in the pack and you're not likely to get another. On the other hand, make that wave and surf it well, and you'll be getting more throughout the session. I think we all, whether consciously or subconsciously, yield more often to better surfers and less often to less skilled surfers. It's all part of the pecking order in crowded lineups.
Hey No leash, you live in a nice neck of the woods…but crowded, yeah? I find the need to keep a little volume just to deal with crowds. One of my boards was a 6-10 and someone on here told me I was riding a “wave hogger.” I found that hard to comprehend when in some of the lineups I inhabit everyone’s on 9-0’s and the real wave hoggers are on 10-6’s.
So for me the extra volume is for crowd control. Then when the waves get big enough extra volume is really helpful and not because of the crowd. You mention the Biscuit and I don’t think that’s a low volume board. I’ve ridden one and it floats! Also, I think it was Rob Machado who said, “Foam is your friend.” Gotta agree with him.
Finally I’m about your weight, although more than a decade older. I ride shortboards and when I plan them on APS3000 Aku shaper, I try to get about 70-75+ beers for volume, otherwise I know I’ll be struggling. I always use the beers number. I’ll have to look for up what that is in liters.
ps I just looked at your profile. I worked for several years for Dennis Choate. He’s actually a great shaper but of long boards. I never saw him shape a shortboard while I was there. I’m guessing someone else shaped it and put his label on it. We had several shapers working at the boat yard including Bill Fury and Chuck Lanphere ( old Unity/Jacobs shaper).
As we get older, say mid-40's and beyond , wanting extra volume doesn't necessarily mean that you want to be a "wave hog". There's a very real consequence to your shoulders when you have to paddle like a fiend (on a board with insufficient volume) in order to get into any waves at all! I hope to be surfing into my 70's and 80's, if I live that long, so I'd rather not blow out my shoulders now, thank you!
Whoever mentioned "board snobbery" here, you are correct that there's a persistent disparagement in the surfing subculture of all those who ride funshapes, longboards, or anything with forgiving volume. It's all connected to "fatphobia" in the larger society - the experience is similar for women who want to buy the girls' boardshorts and find that, in some brands, what is marked as a size 13 is more like a size 5! And, it's connected to ageism too. We aren't all teenage rippers or anorexic supermodels - so let's live and let live, and ride what we enjoy and what works best for us. :-)
i’m 6’1, 240 lbs, and i live around cocoa beach. just started shapin my first board…8’ 2, and 3 inches thick. everything about this board i got set up for a fat man to catch small mushy waves. i’m sure they’ll give me a bit of grief out by the pier when they see my fat caddy, but then i’m out there surfin for myself and i’m making a board cause i want to. i enjoy shootin the crap with the fine folks out by the pier…but i’m never gonna win any approval as a 38 yr old noob anyway, might as well do what gives me the stoke. and i am definitely stoked. thanks to all the sway’s for the killer input on here…couldn’t have done it without this site and your input. next year i’m hopin to weigh in a lil lighter…and maybe i’ll break out a board with less volume then…
Who cares what the line up thinks when you show up with a bigger board, they are pissed knowing you are a threat with bigger board. I'm 6'4" at 225 lbs and in great shape but at 46yrs old my shoulders can't handle long sessions with a smaller board. I ride a 8' x 23 1/2" x 3 1/2 " board I made for me and I can hang with anyone in the line up. As we get older we get smarter, I made a board for my 6' 5" 240lbs nephew in Stewart Florida that is bigger than the norm and he rips the shit out of it and to quote him " It's all about the fun factor, if you ain't catchin waves then it's no fun
For me, I prefer to ride the smallest board I can ride for the conditions. At 40 years old, 6'1 and 200 poundsI go down to a 6'5. traditional thruster.
Last season I tried a 6'0 Firewire Dominator out for a few sessions. At 40 years old that was the shortest board I had ridden since I was 16 years old. It caught waves just fine which was surprising to me. Ultimately I could not get past the awekward feeling of having such a small and boyant board under my feet. It felt awekward in turns and with so much less rail to work off of I couldn't generate the speed I wanted. Who knows, perhaps if I had given it time in the right surf I could have figured it out.
To the original poster, you are from the same generation as me. I would find someone to make you a 6'4 late 80s style thruster. (Think Pre Potato Chip) Thicker and fuller with a flatter rocker than todays boards. You will be amazed how much fun you will have on it.
I got back into shaping precisely because I couldn't find an 80s style thruster in any of the shops. I searched every shop within 50 miles. Perhaps that could be a hint for some of you aspiring board builders. Its people from my generation right now who have the money and are spending on boards. Don't forget us 35 to 45 year olds. We don't all want to ride longboards.
My favorite board from when I was 20 alongside the board I am now riding at age 40.
it ends with super light materials that give a lot of float for near to no weight, at high strength
epoxy will be soooo outdated in 30 years, my children will laugh at me, the epoxy board rider, old school!
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I reckon it'll end with George Greenough style Spoon boards but upside down, where theres rails and a deck but the 'volume' and bouyancy is entrapped air beneath the board's shell.
You’re asking us what to ride? You’re 36 and seem to have ridden them all. At this point, you’ve earned the right to ride whatever the hell you want.
I was talking to a friend the other day… as I’ve gotten older, I’ve ralized the first thing that goes is the need to prove something to someone else. After that, and for quite some time, you still have the need to prove something to yourself. But after that, you stop needing to prove anything to ANYONE, including yourself. That’s when you know who you are, and what you want out of surfing.
So… the most important question you asked was the last one… “Should I even care?” Hell yea…
You wanna see how low volume you can go? Find out, brother!
... On the other hand, who doesn't want to push themselves to improve, to be riding the latest and greatest, and to be viewed in the lineup as someone with the skill to ride a low-volume board well (which then results in you getting more waves?)
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I don't think thats the path to getting more waves, it is practise that helps wavecount. Riding a board that is too small is not a good look. Yes I do want to perform up to the limits of my ability and circumstances, but shrugging off my "off-days" where I don't get many waves or don't surf as well as I normally do helps keep surfing enjoyable.
in moderate sized waves lots of volume doesn't help me catch the wave. The reason why I like plenty of volume is for paddling - I can endure more repeated long paddles out thru the channel and sprint paddle to escape sets and fight currents better with volume.
What I've done is get HP boards designed for much bigger surfers than me. They are "pro model" boards so have fairly pinched rails, this means I can bury them in a turn. This means that the volume is in the stringer region. I can state with reasonable confidence that for someone like me (I'm a bit crap) its pinched rails that give me the rail bury performance rather than thickness in the middle. The reason why I have confidence with this statement is coz of the two pro model boards I own if anything its the thicker one in which I get a deeper rail bury (clever rocker) - they both have approximately the same pinched rails in the mid section of the board. I have however had a board with rails too pinched some years ago - it had a tendency to accidentally sink a rail and make me lose my balance - so thats when the rails have gone too thin.
My mate's latest board is a 6' 6" Webber Pulse - his feeling was that the 6' 6" was better for him based on his previous ride, but the marketing material was suggesting a 6' 3" would be better for his weight. I told him not to worry about what the advertising says and he is very happy he got the bigger one. He is a very competent surfer same age as me.
I realise this photo is not spectacular, but it does show that I can bury the rail on a board that is thick in the middle but has pinched rails
I'm 10kg+ lighter than i was 12 months ago, and at 77kg, im not heavy at all, but i LOVE foam. There, i said it, my secrets out haha. My 7'10'' x 22 x 3 midlength, my 6'6'' x 21 x 2 3/4 bat tail quad fish, and my 6'3'' x 20.5 x 3 ( and super chunky ) twinny are all fat, wide and f&cken fun. A "shortboard" to suit me would be roughly 6'10''-7' x 21-21 1/2 wide x 2 3/4 thick, and im not scared to admit it.
As you likely recall from our past communications, it's often not so much the overall thickness of the board as the rail foil.... where the fullness and taper are placed.
For some of my longboards, I try to decrease the amount of rail buried by carrying the rail fullness farther back and tapering only the rear 1/3-1/4 of the rail line. This position generally conforms to the hips in the outline curve as well as tail rocker apex.
On a shorty, it is sometimes more important to maximize rail engagement although the shortened wheel base concept can be carried over to shortboards as well for certain conditions.
For many surfers of my age, more volume is more better which is why I almost laughed out loud when I saw the title of this thread. Wasn't it back in 1970 when Rolf Aurness rode his 6'10" when the "rest of the pack" were basically floundering on boards that in retrospect were just plain too short? History does tend to repeat itself and I do laugh out loud when I hear the sales pitch for sub 6 foot 'fish' that "Paddle like a longboard."
Surfline: "The World Contest was held at Bells Beach, near Torquay in Victoria, but a lingering flat spell drove contest organizers to relocate the final day's competition to a remote beach near the daily-farming community known as Johanna. There, in dwindling daylight, on May 13, 1970, Aurness rode his 6'10" Bing Foil to the World Title, clearly dominating the rest of the pack, most of whom rode shorter boards."
