Dang Oneula. Why the heavy heart? It’s just surfing and surfboard building. Who are these self promoting spy’s? I read this stuff almost daily. Am I missing something? Most of the threads do not interest me. If a thread goes over 25 or so replies I usually lose interest. Is the self promoting hidden agenda in there someplace? I must have missed it. The Penguin/Tinkler guys were so obvious their rants were hilarious. Has it become more sophisticated that I’m missing something here? I guess I take very little of this seriously. Sway’s is what it is. Mostly a bunch of hobby builders and hopeful wanna bees having a little fun. Sometimes a real pro checks in for a little sobering of the discussion. I like that. I thought your request to give Bert a hand was strange. I don’t know Bert, but he strikes me as the kind of guy that does not need or want that kind of help. My wife and I donate a lot of money to various needs. Not to board builders in tough financial circumstances(assuming he is). I thought Roy’s wax request was tongue in cheek. Still do. Oneula, I post this in spirit of friendship and not a challenge. I respect your views even when I disagree. What worries me is not the spiralling down of a surfboard website, but the heavy heart of another human being. It’s just surfing, brother. For fun and self expression. None of the other stuff really matters. Ida is real. Oldy, Balsa, and Hick’s losses are real. The rest of it is just a bunch of people who were lucky to live now and where we do so we can live our little fantasies. Mike
The answer to all this is fairly simple. There are other message boards on this site for industry discussion. Lets just keep this one to pure surfboard design, if you feel like flaming someone - don’t. If you have to, use the PM.
Maybe we could have a RANT or OT message board, some of that stuff is worth reading.
Just to steer this discussion in another, although related, direction: Organic is a kind of buzz word isn’t it? Roy’s formula may be less processed, but the BIG wax makers use petro chemicals to make their products, and where does that come from? Oil, which comes from the decaying remains of plant matter.
White sugar is organic. Not so good to eat a lot of it, but it comes from cane. Arsenic and methane are organic too.
So what is the exact definition of Organic? Not processed, or processed somewhat, or 10% processed, or with added something, but not too much added? Or pleasant to smell and taste? Why is “organic” such a magic word?
Doug
Sillyyou must admit sir royals attitude has matured since
his early demands for template paments
were chastised by the macadamianut gallery
Paul Jensen taught him to give it away
the fact that a promoter took the op to run with the iadea
is predicktable.Tonge in cheek aside
please send all proceeds for the Idea for involentary breathing
to me at
http/:www.mirror mirror on the wall I need a new hat.org
thanks oneula for getting it
some kids do
others dont.
nobody out is nobody out
some times I see spirit riders
when nobody is there
I wanna surf like them
I’m over ads
aloha from waipouli
…ambrose…
former residence of moi’keha?
Hi Oneula,
I didn’t mean to upset you in any way, just ‘taking the piss’ as they say.
When you bought those Dragonboard plans I assumed that you wanted to build the board, didn’t realise that it was a donation (thankyou).
I’m, with Rooster in hoping that you feel more cheerful soon.
All the best
Roy
Just to steer this discussion in another, although related, direction: Organic is a kind of buzz word isn’t it? Roy’s formula may be less processed, but the BIG wax makers use petro chemicals to make their products, and where does that come from? Oil, which comes from the decaying remains of plant matter.
White sugar is organic. Not so good to eat a lot of it, but it comes from cane. Arsenic and methane are organic too.
So what is the exact definition of Organic? Not processed, or processed somewhat, or 10% processed, or with added something, but not too much added? Or pleasant to smell and taste? Why is “organic” such a magic word?
Doug
Hi Doug,
You are right, organic is a buzzword, here are definitions from
http://uk.encarta.msn.com/dictionary_1861737425/organic.html
<span style="font-style:italic"></span> <span style="font-style:italic"></span> <span style="font-style:italic">organic </span>
adjective Definition: 1. of living things: relating to, derived from, or characteristic of living things
2. developing naturally: occurring or developing gradually and naturally, without being forced or contrived
3. intrinsic: forming a basic and inherent part of something and largely responsible for its identity or makeup
4. naturally efficiently organized: being made of parts that exist together in a seemingly natural relationship that makes for organized efficiency
need to integrate the various functions of the department into an organic whole
5. agriculture avoiding synthetic chemicals: relating to or employing agricultural practices that avoid the use of synthetic chemicals in favour of naturally occurring pesticides, fertilizers, and other growing aids
6. food produced without synthetic chemicals: grown or reared without the use of synthetic chemicals
a wide range of organic produce
7. medicine of body’s organs: relating to the organs of the body, specifically to basic changes in them brought about by physical disorders
8. chemistry based on carbon: belonging to a family of compounds that have chains or rings of carbon atoms linked to atoms of hydrogen and sometimes oxygen, nitrogen, and other elements
As you say petroleum based waxes can be described as ‘organic’ … . . however I think that most people, if asked what ‘organic’ means in the context of surfboard wax would expect that it describes a non toxic wax made from relatively unprocessed vegetable matter.
Ultimately all language definitions can be broken down, what we have to strive for is clarity in communication, and hopefully the word ‘organic’, ( along with the list of ingredients) is sufficiently clear in meaning.
My brother is generous to the point of stupidity. He is also a firm believer in fair play.
He doesn’t just talk about stuff, but usually walks the talk. He was the first guy in Hawaii with a firewire board. One of a handful who believe in the Alexander Gemini. He wrote to Brewer in the 60’s and followed the zany experiments of Tom Morey and Mike Hynson in the early 70’s.
He reads more stuff and reads it faster than anyone I know. He also has a photo graphic memory, so he only has to read something once. And most of all he loves new and different technology, especially in surfboards.
I’ve seen him get totally involved in Sways for several years. Now I see him being driven away. Too much drama, too much BS, too much negative crap. People want everything, but no one is willing to give.
Last weeks get together seemed to pull him out of a funk about Sways people. But some of you are pitiful.
His heart is heavy, first with CMP dropping out, and now with Bert losing something he hoped would be great.
Last year he stopped making boards after my Dad passed away. We just started up this year, and now you guys have him all bummed out again. I wouldn’t be surprised if he stops posting. He told me he would several weeks ago.
Harry (oneula’s brother)
im willing to share what ive learned Harry
if someone asks me?
i generally answer in pm to people that are friendly and open and post there name etc
just not intersted in sharing everything with the whole world
or have my threads hijacked by cats without any experience
im not claiming im a great builder or anything
my shaping and glassing experince is limited
most of what ive got wrt composites and bagging is from sabs
and im really enjoying the journey
and have pride in my work
if bernie asked me id give him just about anything i know ,that isnt someone else IP
i dont know berts situation
and i dont really know what its got to do with me
true
more mellow
im over ads as well
those that mistake sincerity for weakness
shortchange themselves.
those that bite and snap at a comment or gesture
of respect diminish themselves.
the nobel prize was given to the man who wrote the formula
demonstrating the positive nature of the win win transaction.
adversarial interaction
has been popular in western culture
for far too long.avarice lack of trust
chicanery and one upsmanship
have driven growth to the point
that some consider these traits as
desirable.
A simple laudatory to praise bert
bitten with an unkind retort
has led to disolution.
a kind remark
should not cause enough pain
to deserve a negative tone.
in the past the request to send some body a buck apiece for the promoting of the third fin was in general accepted without pause.
plenny guys was tree finning long time .
hmmmmmm.
appreciate = make worth more
depreciate= make worth less
I appreciate O’s respect
and gratitude for bert’s influence.
I applaud his attempt
to garner a financial snowball effect in bert’s favor.
I applaud his deletion of my extensive rant in his support
seeded by tom,roy stewart,bloke’s
signature snipe.
roy has grown in character
over the past few years
he owes this to the patience
of many of the critics here at swaylox
I thank dr. O for his patience and giving spirit
characteristic of the hawaiian Islands
that infact gave surfing to the world
as a gift.
A gift that so many chose to commodify.
it continues to commodify with impunity.
All this is a bizarre twist to appreciation.
and then to snipe and argue over the trappings
assigned to the gift is dis heartening.
Take heart O-man
the dawn brings more waves
roy is a better man for his contact with surfing
and more over with you and surfing’s cultural roots
denied him in his former life before swaylocks.
we do make a difference.
the world is getting better
one kindness at a time.
someday the confused will look back
and realise the kindness
and rise to repay the debt.
god bless roy stewart
…ambrose…
god bless oneula and the hawaiian ancestry
to whom we who surf are indebted.
just a little sidebar here -
I'd wish the wax makers, mainly SEXWAX, would put a warning on their lable in regards to littering and discarding the f---ing plastic wrappers. I pick those things up off the beach and trail every time I surf. they are kind of like cig. butts.
Just a little side bar.
My brother has a lot of respect for some of you here on Sways, I think you know who you are. He has a lot of respect for the stuff the Roy does. Like I said earlier, he likes things that are different.
We’ve been using the internet for a long time now, him much more than me. We’ve seen how it changed from an open exchange of information to the money making mess the www has become.
What swaylocks was and still can be was what made the internet such a great tool.
The really smart people know that sharing is the way for all of us to grow. Taking care of those in need is what a family or a community is supposed to do.
Last Sunday we met with a bunch of swaylocks brothers. Some came a long way to be there. We all brought something to eat or drink or give away. We all brought boards to look at and we talked about building boards, riding waves, other great builders, and how things were in the past. At the end of the day, all the left over food was given to a bunch of hungry homeless people. That’s what swaylocks is about, the sharing of knowledge, the exchange of ideas, the positive vibes, and helping others in need.
Several people commented that just about everything you need to know is in the archives, so if you have a question, just do a search. But it’s the other stuff that is important, the sharing of new and maybe a bit wild ideas. Unfortunately, there are now a bunch of people just waiting to jump all over that stuff and try to capitalize on it. That’s always going to be a problem, but there’s got to be a way to keep the ideas flowing.
One thing I was amazing when I first started lurking here was the number of people in places I’d never expect to be board builders. I think that is a great thing because we tend to get locked into designs that work wherever we live and stop pushing the envelope. But we also need to remember that what works for me on the south shore of Oahu, will not work for the guy that lives at Sunset or Pipeline on the north shore of Oahu. That would go for those living in faraway places as well. So arguing about designs can be silly because I don’t ride the waves in England or the east coast of the USA. I only know what works for me, and that doesn’t even work for other guys I surf with. But I certainly like seeing other people’s designs and I have had a ton of fun incorporating those design elements into boards over the last few years. I’ve made a few really bad boards trying to incorporate design elements, but it’s all good learning. And no shop builder would do any of those design combinations ever.
So all of you out there contributing ideas, I say Mahalo Nui Loa. Keep it coming.
Aloha, Harry (oneula’s bro)
i remember bert mistook me for roy when i first joined and i was talking about tunning board musicaly
i really likes berts post and found them inspiring
i learned alot through his posts
thanks bert
hope it all goes well
Will no one speak for the bees? I don’t really care whether or not my wax is organic. I just want it to be “cruelty-free” surf wax. Here’s some more info about bee cruelty http://www.veganpeace.com/animal_cruelty/BeesCruelty.htm