That`s all right… not to worry, Coral! Hey, have those new school > teachers managed to learn anything yet? Still a little early to tell, Mr. Solomnson. But, one odd thing that I have noticed, is that, they all raise their hand before they ask me a question??? I am having some nightmares about going into the fifth grade in a couple of years, though. I keep dreaming, I’m seeing these Pansies growing out of white patent leather shoes. And, their all wearing white belts, cinched up under their ribs. Plaid shirts, and pleated wool trousers. That teacher’s freaking me out. I don’t want to learn any more about Pansies. My sister says it’s a fad(sp). You be good … Have fun!! > Dale
Dale dale, the way you’re describing it (and what i’ve seen from greenough footage) it seems like surfmats work best in good point surf. i have been intrigued (i really want to give it a go someday!) by the concepts of mats- however if i imagine myself sitting with a surfmat in the lineup on a good day at a good point break in socal (let’s just say the bu or rincon!) i probably would either experience a lot of hostility and bad vibes from all the stand up surfers or end up not catching any waves at all since everybody would probably outpaddle me. it would only work if like greenough described it in the surfer’s journal article that all the surfer’s would ride mat’s - then 200 people could ride rincon bouncing of each other like rubber balls… aloha, flo – flo, I contacted Kenny Hughes to get his opinion on your comments. You might remember both the great photo of him at Hammonds Reef, by Greg Hughlin, as well as the section he wrote in “Inflatable Dreams”, The Surfer`s Journal, Late Spring 2000, Vol.9, No.2. Of particular note is his concluding paragraph… enjoy. “Hi, Dale – yesterday was a busy one and I was unable to get back to you right away. Here’s a few thoughts on your question: Yes, mats do work very well in a peeling point waves, but so do most boards, and I would say given the choice, those spots are where the majority of surfers would prefer to ride. Except my psycho friend from Ocean Beach, SF who thinks that points are too easy and would rather go out at double overhead Silver Strand (crunchy beachbreak) instead. So chances are that it will be CROWDED when you paddle out at Rincon or the Bu. And yes, it will be difficult to get waves–but it’s difficult for everyone. I can’t say I’ve EVER experienced any outright hostility. Bewilderment, yes, disbelief, yes, nostalgia (Hey, I used to ride one of those. No you didn’t, buddy…) yes. You’re also a notch below the boogers in the pecking order scheme, and it’s quite a challenge sometimes to find a wave to yourself. Fortunately, in SB where I do most of my surfing, most of the old timers remember George (Greenough) fondly and there is at least a small degree of respect. When Rincon’s really cranking I usually go somewhere else, because it’s just too ridiculous. I usually go for the tweener days there, but occasionally I find myself out there duking it out. I get snaked plenty right at the get go, so does everybody, but I will say that once I’m up and going I don’t usually get hopped. Whether that’s latent George respect or just politeness I don’t know. There are some nice guys out there, in fact I’d have to say that surfing has gotten friendlier than it was in the 70’s. Everyone realizes it’s just going to be crowded and you may as well adapt and make the best of it. If you’re gonna be out there scowling you may as well be mowing the lawn. I had one great experience last winter out at the Indicator. It was a smallish day 3’-5’ but fun, and I lucked into this really nice bowly backdoor. As I was dropping in, there was a guy in the perfect position to snake me. He looked, smiled, and backed out. When I paddled back out and thanked him he said, “what’s the big deal? You had the wave, it was your turn. We’re supposed to share, isn’t that how it works?” Yeah, but this is Rincon! It was very heartwarming to encounter such old-school manners, especially since it was a young guy. So my main worry is not bad vibes. I’m just wondering if there’s ever gonna be a friggin’ swell again! It’s been flat for so long… One last thing I should mention is that I have lots of fun on the crummy days, probably more so than when it’s perfect. That’s where the mats also excel and where you’ll get more lonely go outs. I remember one of the first times I saw George, I was out at Rincon and it was just flawless. I was riding a Steve Lis kneeboard and it was working great in the 6’ peeling, ultra glassy conditions. George came paddling by with his spoon muttering about the crowds, and says “I wish the south wind would come up, put a little texture on it and make it interesting…” And off he paddled, and I’m wondering, south wind? Doesn’t that make it all crumbly and horrible? Yes it does. And it also makes all the surfers go home–except you…” Kenny
–>>> flo,>>> I contacted Kenny Hughes to get his opinion on your comments. You might > remember both the great photo of him at Hammonds Reef, by Greg Hughlin, as > well as the section he wrote in “Inflatable Dreams”, The > Surfer`s Journal, Late Spring 2000, Vol.9, No.2. Of particular note is his > concluding paragraph… enjoy.>>> “Hi, Dale – yesterday was a busy one and I was unable to get back to > you right away. Here’s a few thoughts on your question:>>> Yes, mats do work very well in a peeling point waves, but so do most > boards, and I would say given the choice, those spots are where the > majority of surfers would prefer to ride. Except my psycho friend from > Ocean Beach, SF who thinks that points are too easy and would rather go > out at double overhead Silver Strand (crunchy beachbreak) instead. So > chances are that it will be CROWDED when you paddle out at Rincon or the > Bu. And yes, it will be difficult to get waves–but it’s difficult for > everyone.>>> I can’t say I’ve EVER experienced any outright hostility. Bewilderment, > yes, disbelief, yes, nostalgia (Hey, I used to ride one of those. No you > didn’t, buddy…) yes. You’re also a notch below the boogers in the > pecking order scheme, and it’s quite a challenge sometimes to find a wave > to yourself.>>> Fortunately, in SB where I do most of my surfing, most of the old timers > remember George (Greenough) fondly and there is at least a small degree of > respect. When Rincon’s really cranking I usually go somewhere else, > because it’s just too ridiculous. I usually go for the tweener days there, > but occasionally I find myself out there duking it out. I get snaked > plenty right at the get go, so does everybody, but I will say that once > I’m up and going I don’t usually get hopped. Whether that’s latent George > respect or just politeness I don’t know.>>> There are some nice guys out there, in fact I’d have to say that surfing > has gotten friendlier than it was in the 70’s. Everyone realizes it’s just > going to be crowded and you may as well adapt and make the best of it. If > you’re gonna be out there scowling you may as well be mowing the lawn.>>> I had one great experience last winter out at the Indicator. It was a > smallish day 3’-5’ but fun, and I lucked into this really nice bowly > backdoor. As I was dropping in, there was a guy in the perfect position to > snake me. He looked, smiled, and backed out. When I paddled back out and > thanked him he said, “what’s the big deal? You had the wave, it was > your turn. We’re supposed to share, isn’t that how it works?” Yeah, > but this is Rincon! It was very heartwarming to encounter such old-school > manners, especially since it was a young guy. So my main worry is not bad > vibes. I’m just wondering if there’s ever gonna be a friggin’ swell again! > It’s been flat for so long…>>> One last thing I should mention is that I have lots of fun on the crummy > days, probably more so than when it’s perfect. That’s where the mats also > excel and where you’ll get more lonely go outs. I remember one of the > first times I saw George, I was out at Rincon and it was just flawless. I > was riding a Steve Lis kneeboard and it was working great in the 6’ > peeling, ultra glassy conditions. George came paddling by with his spoon > muttering about the crowds, and says “I wish the south wind would > come up, put a little texture on it and make it interesting…” And > off he paddled, and I’m wondering, south wind? Doesn’t that make it all > crumbly and horrible? Yes it does. And it also makes all the surfers go > home–except you…”>>> Kenny during Gearge’s last years here he mainly surfed those uncrowded,junky, blownout days, and still ripped.
during Gearge’s last years here he mainly surfed those uncrowded,junky, > blownout days, and still ripped. george g. george g. oooh yeah- and if they worked that good, then they
d be everywhere, right? wheres all the hot shots, seen on what t-shirts and ball caps, nobody endorses them, in what movies??? funny but I havent ever seen one in the water. fact is, we dont need another breed of booger.
george g. george g. oooh yeah- and if they worked that good, then they
d > be everywhere, right? wheres all the hot shots, seen on what t-shirts and > ball caps, nobody endorses them, in what movies??? funny but I havent > ever seen one in the water. fact is, we dont need another breed of > booger. you are funny man funny
george g. george g. oooh yeah- and if they worked that good, then they
d > be everywhere, right? wheres all the hot shots, seen on what t-shirts and > ball caps, nobody endorses them, in what movies??? funny but I havent > ever seen one in the water. fact is, we dont need another breed of > booger. Very Low volume, very high quality… I guess thats beyond comprehension for some people in todays world. In no way are modern high performance surfmats the offspring of Tom Morey`s “Boogie” bodyboard, and there is almost no similarity between the feel, performance and function of either… like others who try to compare apples and oranges, you also need to do more research before coming to conclusions. Dale
george g. george g. oooh yeah- and if they worked that good, then they
d > be everywhere, right? wheres all the hot shots, seen on what t-shirts and > ball caps, nobody endorses them, in what movies??? funny but I havent > ever seen one in the water. fact is, we dont need another breed of > booger. “Did you do it for love or did you do it for money?” -some other old fart
george g. george g. oooh yeah- and if they worked that good, then they
d > be everywhere, right? wheres all the hot shots, seen on what t-shirts and > ball caps, nobody endorses them, in what movies??? funny but I havent > ever seen one in the water. fact is, we dont need another breed of > booger. probably have not seen one 'cause you’re too busy looking at all the stickers plastered on your board…
probably have not seen one 'cause you’re too busy looking at all the > stickers plastered on your board… Thank you!! I couldn’t have said it better … have fun
“Did you do it for love or did you do it for money?”>>> -some other old fart FYI, I
ve been designing, building and testing custom surfmats since the mid-1970s at substantial personal expense, having invested several thousand dollars by the early 1980s, and hundreds of hours of labor. For example, a number of my early surfmats required 40+ hours to complete, with material costs exceeding $25.00 per yard. In 1982 I began experimenting with mil-spec nylon and PU materials, resulting in the original prototype, nylon/PU, "Hero" mat for George Greenough, who wrote me a check for $80.00... shortly after the inspiration of that first ultralight mat, 4th Gear Flyer was formed, initially being made up of Paul Gross, George Greenough and myself. Over the following years, I have stumbled along, persevering through the tedious process of resolving numerous lingering questions relating to surfmat design and construction, not to mention the necessity of designing and building all my own equipment/tooling and fabrication methods... much of which has evolved in parallel course with my surfmats, and related projects. Since the summer of 2000, I have finally begun to see some financial return (is there something wrong with that?) on my 25+ years of curiousity and experience resulting in a progressively refined, custom, handcrafted piece of equipment that offers true, one-of-a-kind, high performance characteristics over the widest operating range of waves and surface conditions, anywhere. The knowledge Ive gained has been worth far more than the cost of the journey. Does this answer your question, “Did you do it for love or did you do it for money?” Dale
FYI,>>> I
ve been designing, building and testing custom surfmats since the > mid-1970s at substantial personal expense, having invested several > thousand dollars by the early 1980s, and hundreds of hours of labor. For > example, a number of my early surfmats required 40+ hours to complete, > with material costs exceeding $25.00 per yard.>>> In 1982 I began experimenting with mil-spec nylon and PU materials, > resulting in the original prototype, nylon/PU, "Hero" mat for > George Greenough, who wrote me a check for $80.00... shortly after the > inspiration of that first ultralight mat, 4th Gear Flyer was formed, > initially being made up of Paul Gross, George Greenough and myself.>>> Over the following years, I have stumbled along, persevering through the > tedious process of resolving numerous lingering questions relating to > surfmat design and construction, not to mention the necessity of designing > and building all my own equipment/tooling and fabrication methods... much > of which has evolved in parallel course with my surfmats, and related > projects.>>> Since the summer of 2000, I have finally begun to see some financial > return (is there something wrong with that?) on my 25+ years of curiousity > and experience resulting in a progressively refined, custom, handcrafted > piece of equipment that offers true, one-of-a-kind, high performance > characteristics over the widest operating range of waves and surface > conditions, anywhere.>>> The knowledge Ive gained has been worth far more than the cost of the > journey.>>> Does this answer your question, “Did you do it for love or did you do > it for money?”>>> Dale yeah so whats your point? current shortboard thruster design and riding are light years ahead of everything else, long, short or inflatable. surf mats offer high performance? thats like saying bodysurfing is somehow more “intimate” or “pure” than other kinds of surfing. face it- they`re both oxyMORONS, dude.
yeah so what
s your point? current shortboard thruster design and riding > are light years ahead of everything else, long, short or inflatable. surf > mats offer high performance? thats like saying bodysurfing is somehow > more “intimate” or “pure” than other kinds of surfing. > face it- they`re both oxyMORONS, dude. Huh??? Maybe Thruster design and riding performance appear to be at their limits now…but isn’t design and performance a perpetually evolving thing?? Regardless of vehicle? the modern Thruster design will someday be regarded like the ancient Hawaiian OLO board of old…And speaking of “high” performance thruster shortboard surfing, I for one could’nt think of anything more boring or generic!! Maybe it’s just me, but surfing’s imagery for now seems to be all about “Busting Sick Air”. Every magazine ad or video has some sponsored clone flying aloft on his board! Young groms strive to emulate their heroes and in their attempts make their own surfing look awful. It appears half the kids who surf nowadays don’t know squat about things like trim …let alone wave etiquette! If there is any performance that is “light years” ahead in my opinion it would have to be that of Laird Hamilton’s and Joel Tudor’s… Style and Class…'Nuff said!!
yeah so what
s your point? current shortboard thruster design and riding > are light years ahead of everything else, long, short or inflatable. surf > mats offer high performance? thats like saying bodysurfing is somehow > more “intimate” or “pure” than other kinds of surfing. > face it- they`re both oxyMORONS, dude. you make me laugh whats your beef?
Since the summer of 2000, I have finally begun to see some financial > return (is there something wrong with that?) on my 25+ years of curiousity > and experience resulting in a progressively refined, custom, handcrafted > piece of equipment that offers true, one-of-a-kind, high performance > characteristics over the widest operating range of waves and surface > conditions, anywhere.>>> The knowledge I`ve gained has been worth far more than the cost of the > journey.>>> Does this answer your question, “Did you do it for love or did you do > it for money?”>>> Dale Ahem. My pointed quote/comment was directed to the originator of this thread, not you. His/her quaint notion that validation of equipment and performance comes entirely through sponsorship, endorsement deals, and photos seemed to bring out the Beast in me. I was at the grocery store tonight and saw two neighbor kids looking at the new Surfing mag. Page after page of photos of people “getting air”. One kid said to me, “Look dude, this is so extreme!”. Looked like a wipeout to me. At least the surfer gets his boards for free. I got back in the Black Bus and went home.
Ahem. My pointed quote/comment was directed to the originator of this > thread, not you. His/her quaint notion that validation of equipment and > performance comes entirely through sponsorship, endorsement deals, and > photos seemed to bring out the Beast in me. I was at the grocery store > tonight and saw two neighbor kids looking at the new Surfing mag. Page > after page of photos of people “getting air”. One kid said to > me, “Look dude, this is so extreme!”.>>> Looked like a wipeout to me. At least the surfer gets his boards for free. > I got back in the Black Bus and went home. Sorry… you have my sincere apologies Manson… I totally agree with you. Dale
Ahhh youth…so much physical ability but the intellectual sophistication of a 5-year old. You should paste this post on the back of your Social Security Card and look at it in 20 years…Limiting your total surf experience to a 6’2"X18.5" thruster is like eating the same food over and over and listening to the same music over and over and…well you probably do that anyway…your loss.
Ahhh youth…so much physical ability but the intellectual sophistication > of a 5-year old. You should paste this post on the back of your Social > Security Card and look at it in 20 years…Limiting your total surf > experience to a 6’2"X18.5" thruster is like eating the same food > over and over and listening to the same music over and over and…well you > probably do that anyway…your loss. Isn’t amazing to look at someone who believes the surfing world revolves a 6’2"x18.5 thruster and wonder what sort of mindset automatically rules out all other possibilites. It’s actually sad to think of how much this person is missing because of his "tunnel vision.'It’s even sadder to think he doesn’t even realize it.
Ahhh youth…so much physical ability but the intellectual sophistication > of a 5-year old. You should paste this post on the back of your Social > Security Card and look at it in 20 years…Limiting your total surf > experience to a 6’2"X18.5" thruster is like eating the same food > over and over and listening to the same music over and over and…well you > probably do that anyway…your loss. Didn’t somebody say he works at a surf magazine? Maybe the 20 years have already gone by!
Isn’t amazing to look at someone who believes the surfing world revolves a > 6’2"x18.5 thruster and wonder what sort of mindset automatically > rules out all other possibilites. It’s actually sad to think of how much > this person is missing because of his "tunnel vision.'It’s even > sadder to think he doesn’t even realize it. you
re the funny ones. surfing is a democracy. mob rule. look at the mags and vids. they dont lie. sure theres always going to be freaks on the fringe. got to have them for laughs. the exceptions that prove the rule. the strong survive the weak complain about it to each other. rippas like us do have tunnel vision and proud of the view! but old folks like you are nothing more than speed bumps on our way over the shoulder. lay the smack down baby!!
you
re the funny ones. surfing is a democracy. mob rule. look at the mags > and vids. they dont lie. sure theres always going to be freaks on the > fringe. got to have them for laughs. the exceptions that prove the rule. > the strong survive the weak complain about it to each other. rippas like > us do have tunnel vision and proud of the view! but old folks like you are > nothing more than speed bumps on our way over the shoulder. lay the smack > down baby!! Not only are you young, but you have no education either! Surfing is not a democracy it is anarchy (if you don’t know how to use a dictionary it means “everyone for themselves, no rules”). If you think the “…mags and vids…dont lie”, then you have no idea what an editor or advertising are. If it weren’t for the freaks and exceptions, you’d be riding a 14-foot long redwood paddleboard wearing a wool sweater (actually, you wouldn’t be surfing at all because it was popularized by the freaks and exceptions in the 40’s and 50’s). No one here complains about 6’2" thrusters (in fact, I’ve probably shaped and ridden more of 'em than you’ve ever owned). Do you actually think that Slater, Irons, Garcia, Mallory, or even Archy think like you? I know I’m wasting my breath…you’ll come around…they always do!