Ok, so the widowmaker setup has been showing up again in various discussions, which is great. I have a problem, though, and am hoping you kind folks can settle this once and for all. I’ve researched, I’ve googled, I’ve read the old threads but still don’t get what the delineation is between a 2+1 setup (single box + side bites) and a widowmaker setup (single box + side bites). I’ve assumed it has something to do with the actual placement of the side fins with relation to the center fin, but as I look through pics of various supposed “widowmakers” I see the placements all over the place. Some have the sides ahead of the center, some lined up at the leading edge or trailing edge, some with sides further back. What gives? Discussions on the subject seem to trail off into philosophical differences between the two without any basic rules of thumb.
So, please, can someone break it down for me: what’s the difference between a widowmaker and2+1 setup?
My understanding (albeit limited) is that 2+1 was was the designation assigned to this set up for longboards first. All fins were boxed/plugged so that it could be surfed as a 1 (single) or a 2+1.
When this concept was applied to shortboards, initially with the side bites glassed on, the term widowmaker was coined.
So I think it’s simply the longboard/shortboard/plugged/glassed on conflation that has lead to different terms being thrown around and used.
The fin placements seem to be pretty similar with the rear edge of the side bites roughly lined up to the leading edge of the rear fin. Adjustments from this happy medium placement in either direction lead to the set up feeling either more like a thruster or a single fin.
Here is a photo of one made by the guy who coined the term for surfboards. I personally don’t see much difference between it and a standard 2+1 set up. I wouldn’t sweat it too much. Once you get them in the right spot, the board will work. Just go find some great waves!
What makes a widow? Something that will kill the husband.
Big waves, dirt bikes, XL trees with dry branches…crab fishing in Alaska…
Widow maker is not a fin set up. It’s a mind set.
Big wave boards are Widow makers by default. Not by fin placement.
Many will disagree…
Stingray.
Widowmakers are a Dave Parmenter creation. Dave was a great self promoter. Probably used the name because Liddle and others were using small side fins and there needed to be a selling point. Terry Fitz was doing singles with small side fins at JBay before Parmenter. I think Fitz called his boards singles even though he had those small side fins.
I think of this as a 1 + 2 because the center is the bigger and main fin. To me 2 + 1 would be 2 large side fins and a small trailer like the way some twins are made now. What you can this?
The name became more widely known after Andrew Kidman, Neil Purchase and son managed to pump it up in the media.
I’ve heard a rumor that it had a bit to do with Spider Murphy’s (South Africa) influence. Not sure if that was before, during, or after the Terry Fitzgerald designs were being ridden. Spider Murphy has been around awhile.
I’ve seen big center fins with little side bites from several shapers including Dick Brewer from way back… long before the ‘thruster’ came to be. A guy with whom I attended school was from Hawaii. He and his dad brought some boards over, including a ‘2+1’ (my name for it) Brewer which also featured a deep football shaped concave at the entry rocker.
Even Dick Brewer has credited Simon Anderson for showing the world where and how three fins should be positioned. Obviously there are other ways to do it.
John,
My first 3 fin board was done in August of 1964, in the ‘‘modern configuration’’ so well known today. Brewer began tinkering with the concept sometime in 1970. I did my prototype of the PressLock removable tri-fins in late Sept. 1970. I then began marketing them to other surfboard makers, in Feb. 1971. As I recall, Dewey Weber was the first to step up and use them. Edit: Other users of the PressLock tri-fin system, were G&S, Hobie, Bing, Surf Systems, Surfboards Hawaii. There were others, but I can’t recall the names.
Maka Maka
IMO, and this is only as it applies to local west coast waves that I make boards for, I see a big difference between the two. For me, a 2 + 1 is best for longboards 9ft. and above. The set-up is as some posters have stated and I have posted in the past, where the center fin is downsized by aprox. 1" from single fin size and the trailing edge of the side fins are approx. even with the front end of the center fin. Adjustments are made to loose/tighten up the turning depending on the surfer. Center fin is located with the leading edge up 2/3 of the length of a standard box. (If you can find it, I posted the measurements I use in an old post a few years ago)
A widow to me is what Dave (and Neil & others) designed/used for boards under a longboard designation. The side fins are up the tail and away from the center fin. The center fin is based on 1" height per ft. of length. This layout is usually used with small side-bites and doesn’t look like a thruster at all. Mellors picture is of a Palmeter widow and shows this particularly. I would suggest to anyone who is exploring making boards to read DP’s explanation of these basic designs. Someone may post a link to the article for me. I hope that one day Dave will update his article with all the changes that have been made to basic surfboard designs as we now know them. Just my 2c…
I’ve also seen examples on which the side bites were single tabbed and fit a single FCS plug on each side. Bill Thrailkill’s contributions are noted. I had no idea multi fins were being used that long ago.
John,
For well over 35 years, I was convinced that I was the first person to put three fins on a surfboard. Then while ‘‘surfing’’ the internet I bumped into a photo taken in the mid/late 1930’s at PV Cove. There were four surfers posing with their redwood planks. Close inspection revealed three small ‘‘half moon’’ fins across the stern of one of the planks. I could barely believe my eyes! Even Tom Blake had done at least one twin fin, during the plank era. NEW is a relative term too. That three fin plank was done before I was born. And, I’m sure my tri-fin efforts were done before more than a few of our forum members were born too.
Late in 1960 Mom and Dad were boinking on the beach somewhere near Ewa Beach Hawaii…
I popped out in early 61 with a full on fin set up…ready to go… i just needed to learn to walk and talk first first. Ben there… done that!
In 1960, a year before you were born, I was hired as a shaper at Velzy. It was my first job in the industry. It validated me. Four years later, in 1964, was when I did my first 3 fin surfboard. Just wanted to give you some perspective about the road I’ve traveled. Been there, done that? Me too.