I ordered a fin for my girlfriend for her long board as a birthday present. Yeah, I know, what a sweet gift…what can I say, I’m a heck of a guy. She liked the new knee leash even better. The fin came to me, and it is gorgeous.
Only question I have is, is the foil OK? It kind of looks like a nice foil in the front, then the sides are parallel for a while, then eventually tapers. See pic below:
I got it because it has the most rake of anything I could find, save Paul Jensen’s longrake fin…that thing is out of control. I figure the long rake (not evident in my picture, but it isn’t bad) of the fin will help her 'cuss a little less when she cruises through the kelp patties, but the flats on the base of the fin worry me a smidge. Should I worry about the flat sides? Thoughts?
The wide base might be a challenge for carving, but not as much as my new (backward?) D-fin!
Some production fins are just that. What I mean is they get 'em out as fast as they can. Foiling a fin properly takes some time. When you selling fins cheap you cut as many corners as you can at the foiling stage. Then you put a real sweet finish on them. They look nice but the flat spots in the foil are IMHO bogus.
Thanks for your input. I definitely respect your opinion, so feel free to opine away if you have anything you were holding back on. I was kinda thinking the flatness was bogus, now the question becomes what to do about it. Do I call them on it, or figure I got what I paid for (~$65). Thanks for weighing in!
Thanks for your input. I definitely respect your opinion, so feel free to opine away if you have anything you were holding back on. I was kinda thinking the flatness was bogus, now the question becomes what to do about it. Do I call them on it, or figure I got what I paid for (~$65). Thanks for weighing in!
–Ben
i don’t pay more than $30 for fins. at $65…take it back, and get one that was done right.
Thanks for your input. I definitely respect your opinion, so feel free to opine away if you have anything you were holding back on. I was kinda thinking the flatness was bogus, now the question becomes what to do about it. Do I call them on it, or figure I got what I paid for (~$65). Thanks for weighing in!
–Ben
i don’t pay more than $30 for fins. at $65…take it back, and get one that was done right.
Where do you get fins retail that cheap? Tell me. The majority of glossed fins you see today were made in China anyway…
If it has a flat spot…call them on it.
On production fins: I have seen my share of guru fins that needed some work as well as many of the production fins. It depends on the pride a company or individual takes in one’s craft over the money they make. It has little to do with production or end of the street guru.
i buy slightly used fins on eBay – all in very good condition, and average price between 15-25 each (including shipping). i’ve amassed a nice fin quiver over the years. only fin i ever bought new (that didn’t come with a board) was a set of Robin Mair’s thumb fins, and he cut me a helluva deal for a center and two sides. though, i must confess, i’ve been drooling over that spitfire fin ever since you and Larry posted that thread awhile back. might just have to break down and get one.
Some don’t think fins are worth much. We all know that everyone has their own value perspectives; that’ll never change. As for me, if someone isn’t willing to make it worthwhile for me to spend the time and energy to do high quality panels, foils and finish work I won’t make them anything. Would you produce a quality product for small wage? You may be able to get fins cheap but I assure you there won’t be much energy put into the technology of the panels and foil expertise simply won’t be a part of production. The Wingnut Sweep you have is mass produced. Getting it refoiled by the manufacturer will be a good trick. Good luck. You can be sure that all of the products from that same manufacturer look like the one you have. What you have was done with a few passes with 18 grit on a high speed grinder to taper the leading and trailing edges, a few more with a lighter grit so that it’ll take a finish coat nicely. What follows is decal application and finish coat and WALA, there it is a $65.00 mass produced fin flat sides and all. Why? Because only one person in fifty will know the difference. The majority’s vision doesn’t get past the shine. If I paddle out in the line up at the point here in Santa Cruz this weekend and have a discerning look at the surfers and equipment my convictions will be confirmed I assure you.
“”""I have the same fin but have not tried it yet but having checked it it also has this flat spot . By all the chatter this appears to be bad. Why?
cheers
mpcutback"“”
It’s not bad for the manufacturer because he he gets more money for less work. But why is it bad for performance? I think that’s what we’re addressing here. flat surfaces do not engage the water. Put a square piece of ply wood on the surface of the water and study what happens. Water only embraces things with an arched surface. As I see things the idea of fin dynamics is to affect board performance, Leaving flat spots on fin foils, which 95% of all thruster rail fins have, is a real fast way to make money off the ignorant. Leaving flat surfaces on single fins cuts down foiling time which equal more money for less work. Know that fin manufacturers are not interested in educating surfers. Face it, they’re in it for the money.
Now when fins have complete foils on them they have much more character and have relatively much more influence board performance. But now the whole picture of fin performance becomes much more difficult to address because they work better. This subject is about as twitchy as a twin fin fish with big fins set too far forward.
Probably the most accomplished fin foiler in the world, Curtis Hesselgrave says, “We’re not done, not at all. Surfing is still a neolithic culture. We’re still in the new stone age. We haven’t reached the Bronze Age yet.”
Wayne Rich needs no gimmick. He thrives because he is a good surfer who makes good functional boards, and this fin is a perfect reflection. Its popularity derives from its versatility as a low area performance template, welcomed by all types of boards.
Halcyon – good point. when I posted that I hadn’t honestly considered your point at all. I did see that the poster was from SB and mentioned price vs., quality. When thinking local, I was thinking True Ames and Wayne Rich. I for sure know that WR designed all of his fins, and typically not making any money off of TA. I’ll tell you what though; they were made here for a long time. At least TA will continue to pay the rent out in the last of the usable work spaces left in Santa Barbara County. Maybe that small margin Chuck gets could afford another tank of gas up the coast to surf Jalama. I hear you, loud and clear.
Some don’t think fins are worth much. We all know that everyone has their own value perspectives; that’ll never change. As for me, if someone isn’t willing to make it worthwhile for me to spend the time and energy to do high quality panels, foils and finish work I won’t make them anything. Would you produce a quality product for small wage? You may be able to get fins cheap but I assure you there won’t be much energy put into the technology of the panels and foil expertise simply won’t be a part of production. The Wingnut Sweep you have is mass produced. Getting it refoiled by the manufacturer will be a good trick. Good luck. You can be sure that all of the products from that same manufacturer look like the one you have. What you have was done with a few passes with 18 grit on a high speed grinder to taper the leading and trailing edges, a few more with a lighter grit so that it’ll take a finish coat nicely. What follows is decal application and finish coat and WALA, there it is a $65.00 mass produced fin flat sides and all. Why? Because only one person in fifty will know the difference. The majority’s vision doesn’t get past the shine. If I paddle out in the line up at the point here in Santa Cruz this weekend and have a discerning look at the surfers and equipment my convictions will be confirmed I assure you.
I run into this situation almost weekly. The high cost of living drives my wage to where a lot of regular homeowners think they can not afford the costs, only to use the cheaper labor from “some where else” legal or not.
I don’t think one could compare hand made fin panels and expertly foiled fins to anything out in the marketplace. To get to that point is special; making a living doing so is even more unique. It’s just not possible to do all of the production here and survive economically.
What we do have is great shapers and designers who go out of their way to let you try different fins to get different feels and results. My friend that I mentioned and posted above would give you the fin out of his board to make you happy and get the desired feel. Still though, barley making ends meet as a designer / craftsman / shaper. All of the fins that I have are beautifully foiled though not hand made.
I’m sure guys like pro box Larry, Robin, Rich, Lox box and others are happily foiling fins all day. I love that, and they deserve the reward.
Leaving flat spots on fin foils, which 95% of all thruster rail fins have, is a real fast way to make money off the ignorant. Leaving flat surfaces on single fins cuts down foiling time which equal more money for less work. Know that fin manufacturers are not interested in educating surfers. Face it, they’re in it for the money.
I don’t think that I have ever surfed a thruster that had a foil on the inside edge of the rail fins.
I thought that there was some sort of functional reason for this. Could you explain why there is no functional reason for this flat edge?
I am trying to imagine how the boards would react different with (all) fins that are completely foiled. What are the effects of a complete foil vs. the flat inner edge?
Even the leading fins on my speed dialer (lokbox) have a flat inner edge, while the trailing fins have a complete foil.
This raises an interesting question in my mind…like a surfboard, a fin is really not a difficult thing to make. The difficulty, like a surfboard, is knowing how to make it right. If youre gonna buy a “production” fin that really isnt that good to begin with you might as well make your own. If it has to be “right/perfect” you should order it from a specialist, no? But then again, same goes for a board. I say make your own till you figure out what makes it right or leave it to the experts.
