I’m not an epoxy pro but I know the basics of how to use epoxy. I have some basic tips if you’re having trouble.
1.RR & Add F. That’s short for Resin Research and Add F. No scrubbing, peeling hot coats, gumming sandpaper problems with this combination for me. None, nada, zip, zero, zilch.
2.Scales. Don’t complain to me if your epoxy doesn’t go off or goes off too hot if you measure your epoxy and hardener by volume. You have to be more accurate with your measurements when it comes mixing epoxy and hardener. For weights under 100 grams I use a separate set of scales that are accurate to 0.1 of a gram. Cost me $30 NZD. For over 100 grams I use some scales that are accurate to 1 gram. Cost me $80 NZD. No excuses for not using scales.
Use the correct amount of Add F! Although I do my resin by weight I add my Add F by volume. Resin Research recommends 1% of Add F for laminations and 2% for fill coats. So for every 100 grams of mixed epoxy (epoxy mixed with hardener) I add 1ml of Add F for a lamination, 2mls for a fill coat. Just use a plastic eyedropper and work out how many mls of Add F you need. Easy.
Temperature. Try and keep it above 20c if you can (25c is ideal). Not essential, but if it gets cold enough, your epoxy will become so thick you will have to work it in between the weaves of the cloth!
You missed “pay attention” I still don’t know how I ended up with the batch that melted the holes I had cut in styrene for plugs. Hot cup should have been a clue!
Where do you get RR in NZ? (actually I’m in Aus, so would be really pleased to know if someone is bringing it in here, but NZ/Aus ain’t too far to ship)
You can add this to your list,dont mix your add-f and x-55 accelerator together and then pour them into your epoxy,they need to go into the epoxy sepparately.The x55 will turn the add-f into little boogers that will be easilly seen and cant be removed unless you remove all the epoxy.
It was really strange,luckilly it was on a balsa board and the milky colored boogers blended ok,if the board would have been any kind of dark color it would have been an asthetics disaster! Cheers
Thanks so much for this. Lots of hard work to make the product effective and the biz go. Chemistry, production, distribution and the economics to fuel it all. This is our 29th year in this and it’s quite heartening to see it all coming along.
This past weekend at sacred craft was incredible for our little business. When you have a couple beleivers talking you up … well, that’s awesome … more than awesome. But when you have legends like Rennie Yater, Bruce Jones, Gerry Lopez, Bill Bahne, Carl Ekstrom … it’s almost surreal.
But then I come back to work and I get to read this … someone who actually read it and did it exactly right …
Greenroom resin is completely idiot proof too. No additive required. No problems at all with the 3 14 foot SUPs I built. A bit surprised it was so easy to work with.
No additive required … then why are we selling Additive F to their customers? We tried that and it was inconsistant in results. Additive F works. We should know, we invented the whole concept.
I actually got this tip from Greg at Cerritos. Paper cups, 2 cups Epoxy 1 cup hardner. I have cups from 1 oz. to 8oz. It has always worked perfectly and I have never had any problems.
Good post, Dean. I know it’s gratifying for GL to see people actually follow the directions and get good results. I remember when he started all this with a kettle in his garage (well, almost) and a vision that there had to be a better way to build boards. I can’t believe it’s been 29 years, though. We’re not that old, are we?
epoxy is easy if you do it correctly. I think many people treat it like polyester and then wonder why they have problems. Another really good tip was the one posted by Rachel. Don’t use epoxy and plastic cups from the supermarket(?) or you will have problems with your resin. Do use cups from a fibreglass or surfboard manufacturing goods supplier. I use the white ones with black measurements down the side. Never had any issues with using these cups.
I have only used Greenroom resin because the factory is near my house, and another local home builder who gave me advice, said he liked it better than RR. I don’t have enough experience to be considered an expert on the subject.
My sanding was easy, and everything cured like it should. I mixed by weight and blended fast and slow hardener to suit the challenge of building such large boards.
The red “dixie” cups work fine with epoxy **until **add F comes into the picture. The xylene in additive F has some sort of reaction with the plastic and will change the properties of the epoxy. Of the three types of epoxies ive used (RR, UScomposites, MAS) the red cups were fine, until add F was added to the RR.
Guys in the factories are adding F because the surfacing agent eventually settles out. They were sold on it being easier and it turns out it’s not. We’ve been making epoxy for boards for 30 years, they’ve been at it for 3. We’ve already done most of what their selling and moved past that long ago. This is one of the reason we sell additives. Consistancy and versatility. They work better, especially for professionals, who really know how to use them. For instance we have customers who B-stage their epoxy and get flip times of just over an hour. They use a combination of heat, Additive F and X-55 to do this. This isn’t possible with any other system. In the case of the resin you used, guys in factories are adding Additive F because the surfacing agent is settling out. They’re using Add F until the drum is gone and then going back to RR. The bottle of the stuff you have says to shake before use. How do you shake a drum? And even the guys using gallons are adding F at the end because their getting sticky hot coats. We’ve been through all this. You can’t pre add surfacing agents and have consistant results. There are too many variables. Sometimes you use 1%, sometimes 2%, sometimes none.
Blending two epoxy hardeners so you can get some “custom” pot life doesn’t really work that well. Pot life is the less important of the two timing mechanisms in resin formulation. In a production you want the longest pot life you can get with the shortest set times. Mixing epoxy hardeners will give you pot life closer the fast hardener and set time closer to the slow. For a home builder this isn’t such a big deal since your probably going to do a side a day anyway. But for the pro guys this is a big deal. Flip time matters.
Bottom line the stuff is just a reasonable copy and not for professional builders. It lacks many features which doesn’t mean it’s bad, just lacking. Funny thing is it even costs more. Guys building their own stuff should probably learn to do it the real way from the beginning. Like the pro’s you’ll learn to build consistant quality.
Does mixing two hardeners affect the integrity of the resin in any way? I was going to mix half fast and slow for my next longboard. Am I likely to see any issues if I do this?
With ours, no problem, it’s fine to do this. Everything being 2 to 1 makes the ratios consistant (stoitimatry is the correct term). I usually don’t do this because the fast is great in the winter and the slow for summer but everyone has preferences. What many people think though is that you could mix fast and extra slow and get a slow. It doesn’t work like that. Too bad it doesn’t. Sure would be easier for me.
Cheers