Custom for Muggsie

General Discussion
21

I gonna call these comments bullsh*t just like I and hopefully someothers here might see it for what it is…

These are hopefully my friends so I’ll mention them (sorry guys)

But when Jarrod pimped his “I got wood” post as well as his last wood creation post which included a board he made for me did I hear anyone complain?

When Ben (SF) put’s his stuff on here in the general discsussion did anyone complain?

When Ben (AU) posted all his brother’s boards and those Earl Peterson boards did I hear anyone complain?

When I posted all my crap including the massive quiver shot in my firewire thread did I hear anyone complain?

So Chandler posts one board each with carefully his crafted photos taken from his very expensive camera from his beautiful backyard at sunset beach and you guys jump all over him because he didn’t place it properly in the “resource” section? Come one that Bullsh*t and you all know it…

I’ve never posted one photo in the resources section and not once did I ever get any heat.

Just because Griffin can make boards faster and better than most anyone here does it call for this kind of response?

Are other proshapers here jealously complaining because Griff is putting his stuff with no lengthy commentary? Geez he’s just trying to start design discussions for anyone smart enough to figure that out.

Or are some high priced corporate lawyers putting pressure on the site like they did on the other site to ice him out because he refused to back down to put out their crappy product for a buck… I’m mean his primary occupation is in no longer in making boards because of what they did and are continuing to do to him. The exact mow the lawn thing Swaylocks was supposed to be against…

Hopefully we can call off the bullsh*t and get back to discussions about design like we should.

And Johan bless you and thank god for your last post, I hope Greg is not too discouraged here to answer it in detail for you so both you and everyone else here can learn something from him…

I really can’t believe this underground hui (and not neccessary the moderators) here turning sways into their little private club…

22

I agree. It’s hypocritical to say Greg’s boards don’t deserve discussion and Paul’s do. Don’t get me wrong, I like Paul and his work. If the job as moderator is so thankless than move on! Greg’s boards are some of the best around, the pictures are superior showing shadows on rail lines. This pales to some of the BS discussed here at times.

23
Quote:

This place is really becoming the drama department.

Eastpac, I think you’ve summed it up nicely. Whatever way you all feel about this issue (and a host of others lately), it’s not that big of a deal. Nobody’s being dis’d here and nobody is being singled out.

24

I don’t see any conspiracy, just maybe polarization on 2 sides, when there’s a perfectly useful middle ground available. I like seeing them in the General Discussion, as I said before. I have to admit (and I’m sure I’m not alone) my bookmark is set here, and not to the main page. I really only look at the Resources when I want to research something or when Quiver hits my inbox and something catches my eye.

Just the same, I have to agree that the difference, Oneula, is that Bert’s, Chips’, yours and my threads with lots of photos of boards were contained within one thread. The front page holds, what, 20 threads? There are always guys who post up a question, often right in the middle of a project, and need some help. Its a shame when those get bumped on down, or even to the next page, before someone who can help sees them. I don’t really see why it would be a problem to put all 5 boards in one thread - and thereby leave 4 more spaces on the front page for other folks’ threads.

I’m not saying Griff only gets one thread & has to find it & bump it every time he makes something. But if he finishes 5 boards at once, they can all be together. Next time he finishes one or two or five or ten, they can get a new thread… its the way its generally been done before, at least as much as I can remember.

And hey janklow, you don’t have to yell, bro. Either constructively join the discussion, or put a cork in it. But posting just to scream isn’t helpful.

25

Really, when’s the last time you’ve finished 5 boards at once?

Greg’s prefaced each post as custom for “

His shapes and glass jobs look flawless

26

Dang man, you don’t have to take a shot at me. Obviously, I’ve never finished 5 boards at once.

I’m only saying, instead of everyone getting all twisted up about 5 threads vs. banishment to the Resources - compromise and put 'em in one thread. I don’t even see how an idea like that could be controversial.

27

I’ve looked at this post 3 times now, only at the pictures and not even reading the responses to the messages until now.

“spam” never even entered my mind until i read those responses.

I guess maybe there should be a “certification” to designate the “professional surfboard builders” from “amateurs.” (sarcasm)

it’s a design idea, he provides useful photos and dims, would probably answer a PM about a shape if you asked. isn’t that what the site is all about?

28

I think maybe some of the beginners might do better asking questions of Greg instead of starting their own thread. Why compromise when one of the good guys offer’s up all of that experience? That’s my 2 cents. A lot of the great board makers have left here because of this…

29

PM to you shortly

30

Yeah at first I was coming down on Greg for post high jacks, but if he makes his own post . … then thats cool.

Spam /spæm/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[spam] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation noun, verb, spammed, spam·ming.

  1. Trademark. a canned food product consisting esp. of pork formed into a solid block.

–noun 2. (lowercase) a disruptive message posted on a computer network.

–verb (used with object) 3. (lowercase) to send spam to.

–verb (used without object) 4. (lowercase) to send spam.

spam (spam) Pronunciation Key

n. Unsolicited e-mail, often of a commercial nature, sent indiscriminately to multiple mailing lists, individuals, or newsgroups; junk e-mail.

tr.v. spammed, spam·ming, spams

To send unsolicited e-mail to.

To send (a message) indiscriminately to multiple mailing lists, individuals, or newsgroups.

That Tinkler guy was trying to sell us something. That is spam. There was no discussion on hows and whys.

Griff is posting his boards that he made for people.

So what, if Griff opens up a post explaining how his board works with pictures and who’s it for (weight height to dims) then that’s bad / spamming?

that sucks. What’s happening here? I agree with Oneula. I mean Griff is posting about something that’s unorthodox, but hey its beginning to get me to open up to his concepts. If people like bonzers and lots of people are likin Griff’s then he’s on to something.

You guys let niya’s post about ?'s that best should be left for an archive search. No slap on the wrists on the posts.

There’s that guy Otay, whos been posting lots of discussion about Macho Man Randy French, advocating popout boards

which is antithesis to the basic premise of swaylocks . . .

I mean Griff is a shaper, shaping locally . . . in hawaii, testing his own theories out . . .

Give the guy a break? You let the popout guys post in the ads, sure, fine they are paying . . .

This is like blocking Herbs threads. If you talk to Herb, dudes got tons of ideas and positive things to contribute. I know they are off topic, but he’s giving good advice that can go over to shaping boards.

you know someone is good yet you don’t give them some degree of freedom, Epac was right with what he said alot of good shapers left … .

I see Jim Phillip’s posts, good thing he’s still helping out the newbs (like me).

Maybe organize the forum . . . like a

Lazy Q/A section: post here if you are too lazy to search / maybe someone will get it to here

OT: off topic

Surfing Tips:

All things wood

forums . . .

Indicator species . . . biologists look at them to gauge the environment . …

If someone that brings alot of aloha to sways like Oneula is leaving, maybe it should tell you (mods) whats going on with the forum.

Granted its also two fold . . . as Oneula’s looking for something more of a new forum feel but

remember to keep the spirit of the law and not just execution of the law . . . execution of the law is always based in keeping the spirit of the law if not then the laws fall apart and the system crashes look to US fascination with people suing . …

As I’ve said before Sways is beginning its slide to Surfermag discussion, but it doesn’t have to turn into another surfermag (well the surfermag design is nice . . .)

31

Hey Benny, will ya don’t tell me to put a cork in it because I used some big letters? I’m sorry if my methods aren’t yours, but one of the mods (perhaps a newly-retired one?) has been deleting a post by maraboutslim on the Wind is Wave thread, and there’s no reason for it. That’s why I raised the font stakes back there. Relax, brother. No assault on your sensibilities meant.

Much Love

I

32

Wish I was named Muggsie…

Mike set only 4 rules for Swaylocks, the latter of which say

  1. Please NO advertising in The General Discussion.

  2. Please keep things you want to sell, promote, advertise etc, in the classifieds or the Marketplace Forum.

Unfortunately there’s not a clear line of when advertising begins, or what constitutes “things you want to promote”.

Also unfortunately, posting a half dozen boards at the same time on the main discussion page looks “more” like advertising or promotion than posting one, or two. Particularly when it’s done by a pro shaper. Just to illustrate the point, if the same thing (posting a bunch of boards at the same time on the main page) had been done by a factory in China, who would be rushing to their defense?

One more thought - if everyone who uses this site donated $5 a year to support Swaylocks, maybe Mike could do away with the paid ads - and then the rule against free advertising (cause that’s what it boils down to) might go away. Similarly, I think the size restrictions on photos in the resources section are cost related… everybody likes the fact that Sway’s is free, but it isn’t free to run - thus the rules about ads I guess.

There’s no conspiracy here, just an attempt to keep the place going the way Mike set it up.

33

If any of you peruse SurferMag you’ll know that alot of these recent posts of Greg’s are old from post’s he made over last year over at the SurferMag forum.

I can only surmise without his confirmation is that he got sick of the “ooh that cool, i want one” response and wanted more design related feedback. Like he’s always said over there… “Hey this is supposed to be a design forum, so lets talk design!”.

I think he was thinking that the Sways crowd being more builder oriented would be more sophisticated to get beyond the high school spicolli crap and ask him some serious questions about what he was showing regarding his theories on board design.

things like…

“hey greg why did you build it this way versus that way”

or

“hey greg why do you make your fins like that”

If responses got back on track more with those types of posts I would’nt be so disallusioned. But at this point every great thread has ended up to be an argument about nothing specifically related to surfboard design. I sincerely miss those spackle and Herb’s future finish days when we really were trying to pass out some actual building hints here and there…

Versus arguing about things that don’t have anything to do with the things greg posts pictures of for us to contemplate.

The first swaylocks question I would think after everyone one of his posts should’ve been…

“Hey Greg, why’d you build it like that?”

not

“hey Greg, nice wave in the background!”

And Greg

I hope you’ll answer Johan’s post and Suf4fins(Tim’s) post here so we can learn something.

And Keith

Greg’s working security now full time

building boards has gone back to being a hobby for now…

yup that’s where its all going folks

these guys are soon to be an extinct species

34

im with benny 100 percent

put em on one thread with info about the design

thats how its always been done

unless u only make a few a year and your old thread is dead and buried.

bernie

i hear what your saying

im getting better at sorting through the rubish

theres still gems to be found

35

i also agree. one thread seems to be a great solution

36

I know that if you ask Greg about fin placement on a 7’8" squashtail thruster shaped out of a LD-04-80 blank he’ll tell you exactly what to do, exactly where to put the fins, toe, cant, etc. And he will tell you what combination of FCS fins to put on that board.

So the guy want to post a few boards. I wish he’d stop posting them because it make me want to go out to the shed and break all my piece o crap stick in half…DAM YOU GRIFFIN, YOU SHAPING FREAK!!!

There aren’t many World Class shapers that ar giving up this info.

Let’s all get over it and move on.

-Jay

37

Grif posted my board a few weeks back and you gotta believe it’s frustrating seeing a bunch of guys salivating over my board before I even got to ride it. It’s kinda like having the only chick on a surf trip.

The only way I’ll get the last laugh is to tell all you frothing swabs just how good this stick works.

But first a little history…

Grif surfed with Bill Keech and me all during the sixties and early seventies. We were on the Haut team together and we’d blast down the coast at the slightest hint of swell to surf Rincon or Baja. We started on 3-stringer Haut signature models with the raw sienna colored fins (Doug’s answer to the Hynson-Frye red fins) and basically wired long boards until we started ripping fiberglass off those sweet boards and cut them into tear-drop miniguns. Grif was always getting bitchen boards, Brewers, Diffenderfers, Sam Hawks and selling ‘em to me once he got bored with ‘em. I’d surf ‘em til they were lifeless and dinged beyond belief in those pre-joke rope days. But Greg was never satisfied. He kept riding and shaping, being a foil to Mike Croteau and learning from Doug and sharing with Mark Angell. In the early seventies I started surfing for Angell and Bill started surfing for Croteau, Grif just kept making his own and flying down the line at right points up and down the coast. Why the history? Because Griffin was there and has always been flying under the radar. He has always had this unbelievable curiosity to build and fine-tune a board. And he always wanted to make that board timeless in it’s appearance and its performance. And in this day of pop-outs and sh@tty glass jobs, where sinking to your neck waiting for a wave are sacrifices most thruster-era boys think you need to make for performance, Greg builds a board that is as fine-tuned and uncompromising in performance and structural integrity than any board I have ever ridden. Plus these things FLY!

I have a 6’4” Griffin twin fin and my new 7’0” rounded pin thruster. Both share the same magical paddling characteristics which are foreign to most of these hyper-rockered, concave-bottomed sticks currently in vogue. Although my boards are not thick by any means, the rocker in these boards literally forms a sweet spot under your chest that just enables you to slip into a takeoff. Bill has a scaled up version of my twinnie and he has the same experience. Greg placed the fins on our twin fin boards way back on the rails, I thought it was weird till I rode it and then I realized that it squirts the water out off the rail in a bottom turn and transitions back to the opposite fin without getting stuck flattening off the bottom. I’m backside in Santa Cruz and this has always been a critical design flaw with most twin fins through the years.

My 7’0” is money in the bank. This board shares the same ability the twin fin has for getting into the wave fast and slotting into the face. Surfers in today’s era do things off the top of a wave I can’t even comprehend. But a lot of times I notice that the thruster gives them the tendency to make these little pre-emptive, setup turns at the bottom before they swing for the lip. The notion of clean, fully drawn out, carving bottom turn just doesn’t seem to be as prevalent as in the days of BK, Terry Fitzgerald, or Reno. At least I don’t see it often enough for my liking. But that’s exactly what my 7’0” does. It carves and just like my twin fin, this board has a fifth gear that comes alive when the wave sets up for speed. It rides like it has a ball bearing under your back foot. Greg has always been a speed freak and he has essentially created boards that have after burners in them. Over the years, I have only found this trait in boards that are shaped by master shapers in the islands of which Greg is an unheralded member.

Thanks for the great board Greg.

muggsie

(yup, that’s my real name)

38

DIG it.

Man, you should write. That’s great. Wow.

39

Muggsie,

I like your board, I was the guy that met you surfing dunes a few months age that went to Humboldt, I have a picture of the flat that I will keep in my car for you next time you come down and surf moss, hopefully my boards turn out as good as yours! or rather I surf them the way they are intended to be ridden!

take care nate

40
Quote:

…

Mike set only 4 rules for Swaylocks, the latter of which say

  1. Please NO advertising in The General Discussion.

  2. Please keep things you want to sell, promote, advertise etc, in the classifieds or the Marketplace Forum.

…

So, in contradiction to what was claimed by another moderator, there is no Swaylock’s forum rule that makes any stipulation whatsoever about use of the Resource Section?

BTW, a note to all: “Spam” is semantically equivalent to “UCE”, “Unsolicited Commercial Email”. Since broadcast email is by nature fully duplicated for each recipient, the implications for internet bandwidth consumption is large. That is one of the main reasons that “spam” has historically been such a major subject of attention. Forum posts are by nature a single copy read by many. Unwanted advertising may exist (for the record, I do not think that GG’s post qualifies as such) but spam it is not, by definition.

-Samiam