hey christian
yeah i tried that first on two boards
and not happy (at least with futures)
i felt it was to rigid and didnt effectively spread the load like foam would
i guess it works fine but a the d cell is easier to shape as well
On another note, the reason I switched to try the futures was becuase since I made the change to epoxy from the clark thing, I have had no luck with fcs and eps/epoxy, everytime it eats through the foam and heats up and ends up being a night mare, never had good luck with epoxy curing in a whole with a plug in it.
i havent had that problem
i use a slow hardener
also the volume of resin in the plug,
if you route out the hole to fcs recomended size and depth,
shouldnt be so much as to exotherm
there must be only 2mm from the base of the plug to the bottom of the hole
thats not enough volume for the epoxy to exotherm if you use a slow hardener(at least 25 min)
also i seal the hole first.
Has anybody had any problems with the gap on lokbox fins? I imagine (and you can see it on some shots on the rainbow site) that the fins won´t sit flush with the deck, especially with deep concaves etc.? Or maybe that is only the case with keels that are longer than the box?
Ive been using fcs or futures. I really want to try the probox. Where are backyard guys getting the probox fin systems? I usually use foamez or fiberglass supply and they dont have them. I am in San Luis Obispo.
not to rain on anybody’s parade because I love the ease of proboxhawaii and Mitch and folks are the best people to work with. But without using inserts of balsa or high density foam(makes the tail even heavier) to put these in they always seem to pop out of my 1lb density balsa compsands. the latest happpened on my 5 fin experiment when I was using a paird of carbonlight GXs up front and a pair of MR twinnies in the back as twinnzer quad set setup (pictures below… This is the 3rd time this has happened to me).
Jim Richardson uses an even softer core and uses FCS plugs in all his surflight softsurfboards, while CMP uses Redex and Ofish’l. I like the theory of Redex in balsa compsands because of the bore through and adjustability and because Pointblanks was using them years ago.
I don’t think you’ll have this pull out problem in a urethane foam blank built board and probox installs are the easiest with their jig setup. So if you are doing urethane go probox you can beat their adjustment and fin options lokbox beat them for fish fins but that’s all.
Personally for me for compasands I prefer glass on wood, aircore or foam core fins. If done right they enhance the feel of the flexing core skin etc etc. Just reinforce the glass on with some S or even carbon glass.
Griffin thought about proboxes as well but they are way too thick to stick them way out on the rail or on really thin tails.
Howzit?!? Some problems have been starting to appear with P.B. The general vibe has been “okay, but not great”, among glassers over here. There are some good points like adjustability, but there are some strength issues. Still, FCS wins. Aloha…RH
Howzit onaula,I had the same problem with the box floating up out of the hole the first time I did a ProBox but it was because 2 of the little tabs were broken of so the box wasn’t secure in the jigs. But Mitch and Robin had that rpoblem fixed by having stronger tabs put on the boxes and have not had this problem since. Heard a rumor that they sold the rights to the system but I’m going to ask Mitch myself if it’s true. I have heard of some problems arising withthe system but not in my expierence so far. ProBox is a good system for those who like to change the fin angle but I’m a FCS guy first but also like using ProBox.Aloha,Kokua
Howzit Rick, Did you talk to Sau about the M3’s, I am going by his house today and will see what he has to say. Like I said yesterday at the bank I have some in stock and you are welcome to some of them.Aloha,Kokua
Faded,
I’ve had that problem with lokbox. I’ve only used the keel fins. You really have to push down hard, something I don’t like to do, while screwing them in. I can get the leading edge pretty snug,but there is still a little gap behind the insert tab or whatever it’s called. I’ll probably end up sanding the bottom edge of the fins to get a better fit. Don’t know if it’s because of the long base and the curve of the board( not much curve in the tail of a fish).mike
“5191 users” , and only about 10 admit to using F.C.S. ??
Okay , then …
so , what does everyone else use , besides the others here who use futures , speeedfins , or probox ??
ARE there THAT many “glassed on fin” boards here at swaylocks , or fins unlimited boxed single fins ?
… just curious …
cheers
ben
From now on i’m using “fin solutions” side boxes. they fit fcs and redx fins and are incredably easy to make your own fins for… no finiky little fcs tabs. there cheap, good value and have there own range of resonably priced fins. for single fins i’ll always use an multi fins (fins unlimited) fin box 10" or bigger.
well personally I have like 20+ sets of FCS fins( live the new M5 series and carbonlites) which is why I use Probox especially because of their install kit and cant adjustability.
but right now I have a potato chip in the back with two small round holes in the back where the FCS plugs used to be. Puzzled, I asked the 120lb hotdogger what happened you hit something?
Nope he told me, I just make a hard turn off the bottom…
Huh, I thought this is a board from a big name brand guy who makes boards for the top pros how can something like this happen for a guy who weighs like 80lbs less than me.
So FCS if not mounted right I guess has the same problems as the proboxes but almost every shaper I know here in hawaii prefers either FCS then Futures and now Proboxhawaii. Seeing lokbox, redex, ofishl, or anything else is kind of rare unless you buy a zesurf chinese board. The new plugs are supposed to alot better. Fiberglass Hawaii now sell a complete packaged M3/M5 or M7 kit for the builder.
Alot of independant fin guys seem to like making fins for fcs plugs versus anything else.
Griff actually custom makes the tabs on his handmade G10 fins adjustable within a 1/16 or 1/8 inch in a standard FCS plug which is neat. Cant adjustment is something else and as I admitted to Mitch I love his 6 degree white inserts, The new H2 are running 10 degrees and if they were made sharper you’d be cutting off alot of fingers toes arms and legs as you pass someone by. A crazy friend of mine nack in the 70’s built one out of shapered stainless for that one purpose as a crowd deterent. Pretty wildwest back then
The Hanalei Fins that Probox sells has some interesting designs as well.
But Ben, with you as a premier customer, does FCS really need anyone else to buy their products?
You put more of them on any one board than anyone else I know…
“lokbox beat them for fish fins but that’s all.”
Sorry that’s all you think we’re good for. How about glassed over for durability? How about ejectable fins? Only system offering it. How about curvature built into the box to avoid flat spots in the rocker? How about the tightest rout fit to minimize weight, and resin usage ? (essential on EPS to avoid overheating). How about both foam or after glass install to cater to most shops routine?
Oh well, I guess I’ll driver over to Taylor knox’s house and take back those 8 boards I just did for him for J-bay. None of which could be over 5 pounds…
According to him after trying several systems he went with Lokbox mostly due the fact that every other system he tried had wiggling fins once tightened. 
The larger based Keels we make can have some small gaps. The underside of the fins are cut dead flat. Only way we can do it. If there’s a gap it should be very slight assuming you’ve tightened the screws completely. If you still have a small gap you could tune the bottom of the fin base to fight tighter. I assume most swaylockians could pull this off rather easily. Not a problem on any of our other fins. Thanks
too much information, eh rick? I’d like to add to all of this that I always consider what kind of board I’m building.
Silly’s right about epoxy and exotherm. As long as you drill the right size hole you will have no problems with exotherm. In fact, I’ve had more problems with poly then epoxy when it comes to plug hole exotherm. I would recommend slow hardener if your working in warm ambient temps now that it’s summer, but even with fast hardener you can get a cooler cure if you add some microballoons and pigment. Just don’t make it too thick, or it won’t flow into the hole right. Properly installed FCS fin plugs have never given me a problem, and they’re my #1 choice for modern boards, including modern fish, thrusters, guns, etc. They do exactly what they’re supposed to do. Also, the new plugs are designed better, so they hold better, causing any breakage to happen to the fin and not the plug or the plug/board bond. And don’t forget… you not only have to install the plug properly, you have to install the fin properly into the plug. If you do that, you won’t ever have to worry about the barrel screw stripping. They’ve put a lot of money into design and their fins perform better than ever now. I’ve also seen some noticeable improvements in construction, but I’m no fin guru.
For retro boards like true fishes or old school single fins, I like glass-ons. For longboards I like standard boxes and don’t prefer any particular brand.
Yeah. Plenty of info. Thanks everyone!
Hi,
I’ve been using O’fishl’s system for a few years. Easy to install in any phase though I’ve taken a keen liking to placing them before I laminate. Very easy to fix but admittedly I haven’t fixed any for a few years. The couple of times they did break the lip of the box breaks into the foam making for pretty easy box removal and very little residual damage to the glass and foam. As for FCS, I am personally quite surprised people are still are enamored by the system. The O’fishl fin choices are somewhat limited but I’ve found templates that work well and have little to complain about. I do prefer the glass templates though! The fins have 4 and 8 degree cants and 6 for the glassies.
That being said I’m looking to become familiar with another system for both fin options and ‘ease of handling the system’. I’m leaning towards Futures or ProBoxHawaii systems. The costs associated with either of these though is quite a bit more then O’fishl’s so I’m hesitating.
Overall I’ve been a bit surprised at how little O’fishl comes up in discussion and can’t quite figure out why. Fins are easy in easy out, a little plastic ‘Z’ clip for ‘hardware’, easy to install and easy to fix… don’t get it.
Anyway, good luck!!
Randy
Lokbox’s comment about Swaylockians being able to sand a bit off the keels to get a tight fit is correct. I hope so anyway. I don’t mind doing it AND I enjoy that sort of thing. That’s the main reason I buy fiberglass fins instead of molded. That and the cool colors when light shines through them. I’ve had to add or subtract material on Future’s, too. I’ve actually had guys at the shop offer to take a little off for me. I tell them no way. I do it. Just bought another set of lokbox keels to try on my eps fish. The Doc’s with acid splash! Mike
Howzit rooster, I think you misunderstood my post.I meant the box floated up out of the routed hole when installing it, not the fin coming out of the box.Aloha,Kokua