How are your board sales of late?

Industry Talk
61

[quote="$1"]

I'm not in the business, but am always interested in the correlation between board sales and the general state of the economy, since surfboards are generally purchased with "disposable" income. So, to those of you who work so hard to build our toys, how is it going? What's your take?

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It will never be like it was however the customer board market is returning a slighty as customers are reordering again after a year of riding and repairing the same board. The retail production is all but dried up and Asia pretty much as that market. Store inventories are finally starting to blance our and by next spring we should see a steady flow of board orders.

I'm lucky to have one shop that pushes custom orders. Just enoung to keep the bills paid.

62

The local shop I supply has put one of my new boards in the front window. They politely declined the last resupply call from the mega mass producer with every label known to man. The shop owner likes my signature inthe foam, and the customers like talking over their order with me. They enjoy learning stuff or swapping stories.

Most of them don’t speak Thai, Chinese or G Code.

If I can supply, the business is mine.

63

…that s real cool

but in my opinion, is not too common…

 

also, I don t know exactly why but I notice kind of a decrease in sales right now and due to $ fluctuation I had the materials a bit expensive

so a I should sale % more of boards (custom) to have an equal earn in comparison with last year

the customers keep coming but others who tripped to Indo, etc bring with bulk of boards at cheap prices (not Chinese but not so good quality + not custom in any aspect)

these customers will back to my wshop, but not until several months…

64

It's fundamentally impossible to mass produce custom boards ............ with all the "belt tightening" in recent years , most people seem to want a quality product when they decide to spend their hard earned money , becuase it truly is better value.  The resale value is important

65

HOW ARE SALES NOW?,

The swell is maxing out and orders are pouring in. It has nothing to do with China doing cheap boards, which pro surfer is currently riding them, even price.

It has to do with NEED.

I’m getting orders pouring in, multiple orders each day for what people NEED:

Small HPSB (hi perf. shortbds), 10 ft. Rhino Chasers, Speed shaped longbds. etc etc.

This is when you have to click into gear and make it happen. The L.A. Freeway is wide open at noon, but at 5 every lane is taken!

It’s up to you if you deliver or not.

No whiners.

66

board sales actually are ok .its time I don’t have enough of.

i agree that china boards are over saturating the market. People seem to want what works

for them. To dial in thier experience level, style and where they surf is our job and can"t be done

generically in china 

67

“others who tripped to Indo bring…boards at cheap prices…not so good quality…” ?

If I’m taking a trip where I have dedicated the time and $ to possibly surf some of the best waves of my life, the last thhing I would do is jones on the quality of my surfboards.

Sorta like what was said decades ago in “Surfer”:

“you wouldn’t hunt an elephant with a bb gun”.

Mass produced surfboards are formulas. All of us have formulas that work with varying degrees of success and appeal. I currently have a new one that surprised even me as to the response and appeal. Since I haven’t had ONE person respond negatively to the design, I guess I should chase the rainbow and mass produce it? Or do I stand to have this ‘early success’ fall along the waysie for being formulaic?

Even the most successful design will have detractors once the numbers trying it increase. It is inevitable regardless of the design. We could compare this to a grassroots movement or a tv show that is privy to ratings. Although the tv show must attract enough viewership to maintain its position. With the mass produced surfboard, it is just another formulaic approach thrown out there.

Such is the nature of living or dying in our world.

One can be precious, one billion is common.

68

Leading up to xmas in Aus. , sales were good according to most people I talked to. The retail end still seems to be a a bit slow.    It seems like the GFC has changed the way business is done maybe. Online sales are definately on the increase , and I know smaller board makers are getting good leads that become sales , from their websites  IF they got quality or "special" .  No idea how the el-cheapos are selling .  Anyone with big overheads, that relies on big sales with low margins is walkin on the razors edge. On-line shoppers can view a big piece of the market in 1hour  while sittin at home with a  beer, and they are influenced more by good photos than good bullshit, so generally , if they make an enquiry through a website , their mind is already made up !

69

…hello DS,

I tried to say that the guys bring back home not so good quality boards

and some of those also surfed there.

so, like almost always,  the bulk of the surfers do not know how to “see” boards or design

the boards that I mention are not cheap

kind of mid range price

some boards have well know brands but low quality work and materials

some are glassed in Bali (not a knock off)

 

my thoughs is that is more of a “mind stuff” or like that

the guy needs to bring “precious” board or relique back to home

 

70

there is a microeconomic term called an inferior good. It has nothing to do with the quality of the good and is defined simply on how the consumer treats it relative to income:

In times of reduced income eg recession the sales of an inferior good go up

this is because purchasers start switching to the cheaper alternatives.

So with the GFC officially over for Oz at least, then sales of the inferior good will be going down. I wonder if the no-name overseas produced surfboards are inferior goods?

71

[quote="$1"]

[quote="$1"]

Leading up to xmas in Aus. , sales were good according to most people I talked to. The retail end still seems to be a a bit slow.    It seems like the GFC has changed the way business is done maybe..... No idea how the el-cheapos are selling ..

[/quote]

there is a microeconomic term called an [b]inferior good[/b]. It has nothing to do with the quality of the good and is defined simply on how the consumer treats it relative to income:

In times of reduced income eg recession the sales of an inferior good [u]go up[/u]

this is because purchasers start switching to the cheaper alternatives.

So with the GFC officially over for Oz at least, then sales of the inferior good will be going down. I wonder if the no-name overseas produced surfboards are inferior goods?

[/quote] Good evening MrJ, It.s just passed 2:00 oclock in the morning, and Ive finished my work for the night . Sittin here with a cup of tea before I hit the sack. I don't speak fluent "microeconomic" , but  I'm sure you understood what I was saying. Recent trends over the last 18 months have led me to believe that when money is tight, people will save more, and prefer to spend on quality, rather than waiste money on cheap goods with little percieved value after the purchase. Quality gets listed under assets..............cheap stuff is "hard to give away" !..........................................get some waves on the weekend?

72

good evening Kayu, that was a late evening you put in. Yes I understood what you were saying but was wondering if the inferior good theory applied and from what you are saying it doesn’t. I think you are right, I held off purchasing altogether during the hight of the crisis - didn’t want to waste money on something second rate. I note that Josh Dowling was ramping up production right during the height of the crisis too! Both of you produce non-homegenous products - distinguish yourselves from the PU/PE market.

I can see how maybe sales of cheaper food go up in times of recession, but cheap surfboards are a different matter - give a second rate surfing experience and surfers don’t want that for a product that is meant to last at least a year.

yes I got some good waves on the weekend thanks, its not easy for a weekender like me to compete with the locals for waves but my efforts payed off - I made this sequence.

pic 1

pic 2

73

MrJ,I would expect a good quality surfboard to last a lot longer than a year !!  Mathematically speaking, if it lasts 10 years , you can divide the purchase price by 10 to demonstate how good the value of a qualty purchase really is.- and quality surfboards rarely cost 10 times the price of the cheaper stuff available. Throw the resale value into the equation and it makes more sense to always buy quality . Some see it clearly and some are more vulnerable to the marketing machine. A new board every year is a good enough reason to buy, and its nice to have a still valuable board to trade in. It,s also nice to store it in the rafters, and pull it down years later and ride it agian,still in good condition. Many of the grommets these days are amazed when they ride a good 70's single fin for the first time. It does broaden thier perspective on surfing in general.........

74

I agree with a lot that is being said. Especially about your single fin comment. A board should last for years now days. Even before nowdays. Go look at the thread on the 8 ft. Owl I did in the early 70’s that the guy is actively surfing in Ireland.

I’m not going to let some genius at branding nor a pro surfer tell me I can only make one kind of ride for my clientele. I know better. People have different tastes and aspirations. I offer a ‘no frill’ longboard with a proven design that people on a budget love…then OTOH I have a deal with a guy that dropped some redwoods on his property up north that we will be doing some very special (and pricey) stuff.

Since time is money, I learn what and how long it takes me to offer the most bang for the buck. I prescribe to this for both direct customers and retail accounts versus playing them off against each other. I’ve found it pays to be fair to both entities.

Since the ‘rent’ comes up at the same time each month, I’ve calculated what type of turn ratio I need to make it worthwhile. Mine is 5 boards per week, doing it all. If I don’t do it this way, I better shape 20 per week if that’s all I do. If they were precuts I could shape 50 to 80 depending on how old I feel that week and what they are.

People tell me that 5 or 6 boards every week is a lot. Is it?

I guess it comes down to your level of experience, how good the product is, what you price your stuff at, and what the word of mouth generates for you.

I’ll add that I’m also underground and off the beaten path, which helps a lot becuz I don’t have people stopping by to chat about the old days or bullshit in general. That alone can be the difference between sink or swim…

75

…hey DS,

that last sentence is very true

and in the last weeks I have been thinkung about it

but dont know how to fix that

I mean, Im kind of underground too but from time to time

customers, etc come here and slowed me in my work at the moment

and the week seems to finish rapid…and with several stuff waiting in-line

plus now I m kind of one-man-band guy

doing the wshop, building other bike, building the garden, painting

and surfing when waves come (and life of course)

so not too much time to spend in nonsense

may be you have some clues or how to s

that in a polite way I would use…

76

Verb… a lot of people thrive on the popularity, or they make our work their social life. I don’t disrespect that. However, I don’t want to hear my friends in the industry crying in their beer about how bad things are. At the top of this thread Dean says “just need some demand”.

Hell man, create the demand.

When I shaped for Clyde Beatty we had quite the setup. A block down the street from the glass factory (which was originally built from the ground up by the Castagnola family per Rennie’s design to rent from them) was the shaping quonset hut. There we had Rennie & Lauren, their office, Wayne Rich, Steve Brom, Max MacDonald, myself and Kevin McClelland. Next door was Skip Sanger (Eastern Pacific) with his cabinetry shop. It was quite the feel good situation.

However… the arsenal of shaping talent attracted a lot of people wanting to stop by for a chat and a look see. It didn’t take me long to realize that in order to get anything done I had to ‘insulate’ myself from the general public. In a way, this is a two edged sword: you need the buying public, we offer a custom one off product, BUT we also have to DELIVER!!!

The historic sluggish delivery in our industry is one of the prime reasons people ended up really going for cheap labor in China and Thailand. People can debate that and say "no way… it was to maximize profit, etc. but much of the shaping bottleneck that was so characteristic of the past got removed with the advent of CNC machining. By no stretch of the imagination should a (skilled) shaper not be able to up his output by tenfold by shaping pre cuts. However, the biggest challenge (today) for any surfboard builder with a genuine work ethic is capturing market share.

To do this, you have to have a good quality product at a fair price…and, guess what?

Deliver!

I started getting this reality some years back when the late Bob Krause and I were, what Al Merrick termed, “the sailboard gurus”. Once the first blow came in spring, every body and their brother had to have one of our custom sailboards overnight.

So how did I handle the opportunity? I started coming in at 5 A.M. and shaping before the world woke up. There is a saying that the successful man gets up early and is always well tanned… so I took heed of that, and it worked pretty well. At The Underground I would have stuff shaped and ready for the glass crew by mid day, all the while listening to the buoy readings for surf and/or wind.

Nowdays I am fortunate enough to have set up on my acre and not commute or pay rent to some slum lord. It’s a legal set up and yet I have all the comfort of home. No commute. But my advice to you is to try what I practice. Be disciplined, treat your business as a job, set goals and crunch all the numbers to achieve those goals. Don’t be a slave to your business, but make up lost time the next day for affording yourself the luxury of taking time off any day you want. Don’t let your ego get in the way… listen to what your prospective customers are asking for and set about producing it. Give the people what they want!

I’m just as excited about a beginning surfer being thrilled with what I make them as a pro surfer. It’s all good, and building a following of young surfers is smart if you are thinking about repeat clientele for years to come. Let them cut their teeth on your wisdom, but be generous in coaching them toward the ride of their life. They will pay you back in kind. At the same time, don’t dismiss the moms and dads that chase the fountain of youth.

I know this truth to be self evident.

No matter how old we get, we all feel we are the same little kid inside.

P.S. JUst noticed this didn’t reply to Reverb, but he will see this so point made…

77

One of the things that I think is idiosnycratic to this industry is how visitors are tolerated/welcomed to hang out and free roam at a glass shop.  Even their pets get free roam. You’ll be working away and all the sudden you’ll feel a cold nose sniffing your leg.

The classic senario is when a guy shows up with a couple of cases of beer to watch his board get made and gets the whole factory crew drunk.

I personally found these guys  to be quite an annoyance. There was this one guy who had Diff shape him a gun and wanted to watch me paint it. I asked him- I know you and Diff are avid golfers. Do you go down to the Taylor Made factory and drink beers with the employees while they make your golf club? 

78

This is surfboards remember? You’re supposed to stand over the shaper, glasser, airbrusher etc and tell them what they are doing wrong!

79

Guess if you need to stand over them to that level you didn’t get the right guy in the first place. I have no qualms bringing someone in and mapping out what they liked or disliked about their last board, or how they want to evolve a shape, or what special need(s) they have for a new one. Then put on my headphones and do the dance til we get to the fine tuning and dialing it in.

A lot of that aspect has been lost today.

A sad shame really.

Models provided validity to CNC files and shapers offering tried & true stuff they have developed over years in the trench.

I am an artist.

I’m also a technician w/o an ego dictating what someone may contract me for.

Some of the very best surfboards were the ones that guys that ride my boards give me creative license. I know them and how they surf and where they surf, and they know I know this. It is the making for magic more often than not.

There’s something to be said for devout repeat clientele.

Treat your customers like gold!!!

80

…DS, I hear you…most I have been applying

thanks

 

-Atomized,

I always talk about those situations…