I get this constantly when laminating. It seems that if I dont spread the resin immedieatly and get it fully wet right away, then this appears. Any thoughts? I do mainly 11’ sup’s so it does take a bit to wet out the board. I have tried many different types of resin but I have alway used Surf Sources 6oz “warplite” cloth. Now it is not like a Hexcell warp E cloth. The surf source brand has a much more coarse feeling to it. And the hexcell has a “flatter” smoother feel to it. Is this my problem? I hav had problems in the past with pin air but I have improved on my spreading tecnique and have got that dialed in. I still get a few but nowhere near as bad as before, but now I believe that the coarseness of the cloth may have had a lot to do with the majority of pin air. Also i have heard a lot of you needing a way smaller amount of resin to wet out your boards. X amount of ounces per board foot. I am using 72 - 80 mixed ounces to wet out a double layer of 6 oz. 11’ x 32" SUP. This includes the rail lap as well (obviously)
Is that the deck we’re looking at?
If it is, that would be were the lap and the resin stopped on the deck correct?
That is discoloration. In the paint.
Usually happens with poly.
As a airbrusher, I have dealt with this a few times.
I originally thought it was because the bottom went off too hot and maybe burned the paint.
Hense that is why it stops were it did.
Nowadays, I have found it is probably my old bad paint.
Always seems to happen with odd colors.
Then again, maybe your lap was too dry. I like my laps pretty wet.
Resin drains on a vertical surface really fast. Sometimes it is better to put extra resin on the lap just before lapping.
This is the bottom of an eps/epoxy sup. and it is throughout the entire bottom not just by the lap lines. I sealed the board with epoxy and microballoon before the foam spray to get a uniform paint job. Also the epoxy is a slow kick 60 min pot life. I get this before even lamming the deck.
You may just be not using enough resin to completely be saturating the cloth.
Try using more resin.
Sometimes, because most do the laps last, the last bit of rein in the bucket is actually kicking and becoming hot.
That will burn the paint.
It always shows on the deck rails most prominately.
Looks like nothing but a dry lam.
Try different fiberglass. Could be the finish on the cloth you are using is not compatible with your epoxy.
Good point. Some glass finishes and weaves may require a longer wet out time for a good soak and bond. It’s possible the resin kicked before it soaked in all the way. But, proper squeegee technique should avoid that kind of issue.
Here is what is really happening: Your adding air to the epoxy resin when your spreading it with the squegee, and by the time you “saturate” the rail it is full of micro bubbles that are showing up against the painted foam. When you try to save every last drop of resin, by the time you spread it and respread it, the resin starts to thicken a bit and hold air especially on the rails. That’s what’s happening, and it starts to look cloudy or milky.
I think ghettorat nailed it. AKA “frothing”
What is proper squeegee technique? I use bondo type spreader and never rake the hard edge of the squeegee on the glass. I always press and pull with the side of the squeegee. I am very familiar with frothing and this is not it. This is more like crystalization. I never seal the paint prior to lamming. But I have done dozens of boards with a wide spectrum of resins, always with the same coarse feeling “warplite” cloth. Does 72-80 oz of resin seem too much for a double 6 oz lam on a 11’ sup?
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Now I haven’t done a lot of epoxy, but all the epoxy I have done is on SUP stuff so, here goes my 2 c…
I think what you are seeing is “nap”. Some cheaper cloths have more short fibers, with poly they don’t show but with epoxy ??. I only use the premium fabrics when I glass with epoxy. All that expensive resin and you have issues with cloth? It doesn’t make sense to me. I have seen this before on boards I haven’t glassed and it is there on the white areas but you can’t see it unless you look at it from an angle so it sells off the rack. There’s a reason that import stuff is painted with two part and its not always the brown resin!! Anyways, I would suggest that you invest in premium grade cloth and see if on the next one your problem goes away. If you still see it, change resins with the same premium cloth. If you still see it, it is technique, not materials!! I learned a long time ago that usually you shouldn’t blame the machine or equipment, but blame the operator! Just my 2c…
PS: Love the spray job, looks great!
I typed out a few solutions for your problem, but after rereading; well I thought, just let the “experts” nail it, and deleted it.
hard to tell on my screen, but I’d go with GR’s theory. I’ve seen that a lot.
Yep rat has it. Theres a reason why you don’t see colored epoxy boards…cept for the surfteck looking ones.
This happens over wood or paint. Change the cloth to a softer more absorbant type. also wet your rails first, and don’t pull the froth to the sides. also work your squeegee a lot slower…you got plenty of time.
wet your cloth out longer…wet it out and go have a beer or something. Pour the resin in long lines, not dump and pull, work the resin from side to side, etc… Completely different work method that poly resin. Don’t pull the resin more than a few inches to a foot when wetting out .
once again…let it wet out, don’t rush…fast= froth Then do your lamination, use a hard plastic spreader…use it slow. And when laminating pull your old frothy epoxy off the board, not onto the rails and laps. if you have already wetted out your laps, then they should be nice and clear, and ready to wrap with out froth.
… and work in hot place with hot “fluid” resin, hot board and hot fiber. Add F is a good helper here. The industrial standard way fiber on resin (and not resin on fiber) is really effective againts frothing too.
Question: Does it look different where you poured the epoxy as compared to where you pulled the epoxy on the initial wet out? it looks like it wet out better where you poured it thick, as to where you poured then pulled. Thats what it looks like from the close up pic. What does it look like from a fw feet back.
If the epoxy resin is a bit thick I warm it with a hot air gun as I squeegee it. Makes it very fluid, wets out beautifully, releases air bibbles, technique works well on foam and wood (boatbuilding). I even put a “gloss coat” straight on as the resin thickens and cures, wet on wet. another way is to use the hot air gun on the glass first, get it warm, displace air, let the (now lower viscosity) resin soak in.
That is exactly what happens. The initilal pour looks great then once i pull it almost instantly crystalizes.
Ok Guys here is an UPDATE. Today I lammed another custom board and I did literally pretty much everything that was mentioned here. I wetted out the rails first, then the bottom. I worked the resin super slow with little to no frothing without pulling any of the deck resin on to the rails. I did another custom foam spray and I did seal it with a thin layer of resin before the cloth lay up. I let the deck sit a good bit before I did the real laminating (press into foam). And still the same result, crystalization in the painted areas. But one thing I observed was as I poured the resin on the board, that area saturated well (obviously) but the second I did any pulling to wet out the rest of cloth, it seemed to get the crystal look to it almost immediately. Again working super slow, not “raking” the cloth using only the side of the squeegee. As I pulled resin from the puddle build up on to the dry cloth, only the puddled area poured from the resin cup looked saturated correctly. And I pulled an good bit of resin from the puddle that should have wetted out the rest of the glass adequately. I am also using 90 oz of resin to lam a 2 layer 6 oz layup. This again leads me to belive that the cloth is crap. And I purchased a full 125 yd roll. So I will be looking into a hexcell 6 oz E cloth instead of this Surf source brand they named “warplite”.
Generally speaking - you get what you pay for, when it comes to materials. Cheap foam, cheap paint, cheap glass, cheap sandpaper… you typically end up paying for it in time and headaches.