Aloha… I see you’ve installed a lot of fins and some edge fins also . You had asked me if I had a Edge install kit … I don’t … I think I can do it with just 2 hole saws…I was wondering if I should make the hole a little bigger to allow for some fiberglass cloth ???
John Rogers was great to get me the right size fins for my fish and he offered to install them . But he lives 2 hours plus away…
Do you… or anyone … Have any suggestions ?? I know to be careful with the hole saw pilot bit so as not to drill thru the deck … Anything else?? Thanks Don J.
Howzit Hotcoat, Don't enlarge the top hole since there are tabs on the plug that keep it from falling into the hole and they make sure the plug sits flat on the bottom. Get the specs from John for the hole sizes(diameter of holes and the depths), it might be worth the drive to Johns to make sure the install is correct so there's no problems later. Another reason to see John is to get the angle diagram laminates that you put under the reinforcement glass patches. When changing the fin angles they are very important to make sure the angles are the same for both fins. It's not a hard system to install but it needs to be done right. Ask John if there is anybody closer to you who uses the system that could help you. I know 1 of the reasons John moved back to Fl was to promote the system there. Tell him Aloha from me. Aloha,Kokua
I don’t have a kit either and don’t think it’s that critical for limited installations. If you have access to a router, I can briefly go over how I do it?
You’ll need to make to two round jigs/templates from plexiglas (plexiglass is just easier to see where you are on the board). The first jig (round, larger diameter) is for cutting the fiberglass and routing out the main hole (shallower portion of Edge plugs) that is needed – this the hole where the little tabs must sit on the fiberglass as Kokua said. The second jig (round, smaller diameter) is for routing the inner part where the plug sits deeper in the foam.
Tape the larger jig down to the board and route the fiberglass and shallower depth that is required. Remove the larger jig and now tape down the smaller jig (centering over the freshly routed shallower/larger diameter hole), and route out the deeper/smaller diameter section that is needed.
I’m at work right now and don’t have the exact holes saws sizes for making the jigs, or the exact routing depths but can post them later if you’re interested. I can also post pictures of the jigs I use. I’m not that good at describing the process but Edge plugs are really quite easy to install.
Aloha And Thanks … For the tips . I have the Laminates but had forgotten them . Thanks for reminding me . I had not seen (or remembered) anything about a reinforcment layer… Can you please tell me how big a patch you use??
Herb if you have any pictures to post that would be great. Do you think I could just use the hole saws directly on the board cutting each hole to the proper depth? How do you center the second jig over the first hole perfect? Seems like the hole saw would be easier to start the hole in the center using the pilot hole from the first saw . Just need to remove pilot bit once hole is started to avoid going too deep. ??? What do you think ?? How thick is the plexi you use for the template?
Once the Box/Plug is installed do you need to grind - sand down the extra lip that sticks up above the deck? Thanks for all the help . I will post a picture of this “Fish” when it’s done I feel it’s not really nice enough to warrant a trip up to see John Rodgers to have them installed . But it is still cool to me making my own Board… Thanks Again Mahalo Don J.
Hello Hotcoat- I have been interested in the edge fin system also. But after seeing your photo it seems to me that an awful lot of the base of the fin is not secured to anything which could allow a lot of unwanted flex in front of and behind the fin tab. Am I missing something here? I hope not because it looks like a great idea. thanks- John
Hello surfersensei … I don’t know the answer to that . You can e-mail Clyde Rodgers at Edge Fins … Their web site is www.edgefins.kauaistyle.com… or maybe some one on here can help … I’m gonna try them it looks like a good system and a good idea to me … sometimes too much toe seems to slow me down and I feel like I don’t need so much toe … Then sometimes … Bigger waves … I need the toe … Mahalo… Don J.
Hopefully they attached pictures help - The diameter on the larger one (left) is 2 1/2", and the router depth is 1/8". The diameter on the smaller one (middle) is 1 7/8" (1 3/4" would work too but that’s close), and the router depth is 3/4".
As for lining the two up jigs up (not sure if you can see the crosshairs that are scribed into the plexiglas) but I just lay the smaller jig on top of the other (bottom picture) and it’s just a matter of lining the crosshairs up with each other. The plexiglass I’m using is 1/8".
The third jig (far right) is one that Clyde sent me awhile back - the ideal behind that one is to trace it onto the board and free router it. Could probably use it for your holesaw approach as well. Using a hole saw - I’m sure it could be done that way. The sides would be clean but might not get the bottom portion totally cleaned - but hey, none would ever see that area once the plugs are set anyway. If you want, pm your address and I’ll trace the one from Clyde and stick into the mail for you.
That extra lip - yeah you sand that lip down, and also the little resting tabs too. One more tip: A buddy of mine set the plugs with the allen screws facing forward and aft - not the rail to rail. Bad, very bad, haha…
The patches - I go kind of small on mine. Football shaped maybe 5"x8"ish.
In regards to the little guide laminates for adjusting the fins. Another option is to place marks right in front of the fins - right on the plugs themselves for referencing your adjustments. I use a drill (barely cutting into the plastic / kind of just making a dimple with the bit) and make three marks that represent 0-toe, 1/8 toe, and 1/4 toe. I just didn’t like adding the laminates - personal choice that’s all.
Thanks Herb… I did PM you sounds like a good idea to forget the lams could be a couple of ways to mark the toe … What size fins are you wsing ? What kind of board are they in? Mahalo … Don J…
I have thought about this “flex” issue that was mentioned and the fins are held with 2 screws and are also the shape/foil is such as they are real stiff.
Howzit Hotcoat,Do you have the lams, if not I can send you some since I'm the one who prints them for Clyde and John. They might have some body else print them also but I have the diagrams on file. Aloha,Kokua
Kokua , Yes I have the lams thanks anyhow… Just got off work 10:30 here … Time to sleep… Would it be OK to ask you a couple of questions when I get ready to install the fins?? Thanks Mahalo… Don J.
Hey guys, Clyde Rodgers here with Edge Fins ! Thanks so much for helping out Hotcoat … All good advice. The fin pics that coda sent in were special large fish fins,( John built for him, thanks John) the disc base looks small in relation to the fish fin but the thick glass tab is proving to handle, the thruster and glass side bites are solid as a rock… And we can build your own template. Try our fin system, I know you’ll be stoked ! How can I help??
Howzit Clyde,Where have you been hiding lately, Check those router depths that Herb B quoted above . It seems to me that the 1/8" depth for the bigger hole is to shallow but since you have my hole saw tool I couldn’t check the depth. Aloha,Wildog
You The Funny Guy Wildog !! I do need to revamp your Edge install kit and set our Kauai Boys up with some nice glass fins ! I am around, I was ingrossed in Keola’s canoe project!10 month’s. Have you seen the 34’ double hulled canoe with the big crab claws on the front Manus? I built that, out of the weeds now and ready for next project! Fin panal for some custom Edge Fins. Who wants some???
I love the look of the fish fins you guys set Hotcoat up with. I going to need to get my hands on a set of them for fish that I have in the works. Also as Kokua asked, is 1/8" the correct router depth for the outer ring? I don’t want to pass any bad information along and create problems for installers.
By the way, the side bites I ordered a few weeks back are working out real well on my long board.
Hello Clyde- I am interested in your system. I am having a 7’0" custom epoxy made with a 2+1 set-up.I would like to know the fin dims of your sidebites. I assume that your material is compatible with RR epoxy? I understand that your brother is in Florida. If so I live in Merritt Island and would like to check out the system, if possible. I am having my board made at Oceansportsworld in Cocoa Beach and it would be helpful to show them what they will be working with if I decide to use the fins. I am also curious to know if you have experimented with setting different toe-ins for the outside fins to optimize frontside and backside handling. Thanks-John
Hello hotcoat- What got me interested in the system was my experience with my last board. I decided to go with a 2+1 setup for a 7’2" epoxy roundtail. While discussing the fin position with the shaper,Stu Sharpe, I asked him what would happen if I had the side fins toed out (more parallel) than usual. Of course he said that it would be more drivey but stiffer than normal. Since I like to surf on the rail with a front foot emphasis I thought that would suit my style better. well, it worked great! I had that on- the- rail single fin feel I liked plus the sidebites gave me plenty of high line drive without that straight line fin drag you normally get from a thruster setup. And the sidebites gave me extra accelareration through those wrap around cutbacks I love so much.
Because of that I think that the edge fins might allow me to fine tune the handling even more. I will make a decision when I get more info from Clyde. I look forward to hearing about your impressions of them on your fish, too. Take care - John
