New to Swaylock's, have question?

I have been a swaylock’s lurker for qutie sometime…never finding the time to create an account. My own fault. I have just aquired a new board for my quiver. I found it in my buddy’s attic. He has had it for quite sometime. We have since pulled it out and made some ding repairs and cleaned it up. I was wondering if anyone could help me ID it. I have some pics and information. I just was wanting to know the lineage of the board, and a shaper I recently met said I should put it out to the people of swaylocks. It is a gordon and smith board and has the the numbers on the the top side of the board on the stringer 8386 72. We are still working on it and I have yet to really pull any good measurements. Hoping to do that tonite. Anyone who can offer any intel on this board would be awesome. I am not planning on selling it, just getting it put back together and surfing it. It seems pretty old…I am guessing maybe 1972? I have done a little searching on G & S but can’t seem to put my finger on it. Before I attach any photos I want to make sure I am posting in the right forum. If I need to go to another forum, please direct me, but form the topics this seemed like the correct place to post.

Thanks in advanced!


Chattanooga, TN

Yes, post photos. Not teeny tiny ones, either. The info you’ve provided so far won’t help at all.

What use do you have for a “quiver” in Tennessee?

A TN quiver should really on consist of a 12’ SUP for use on the rivers and lakes. I am a sales rep for a kayak company and travel a lot and spend a fair amount of time on the east and west coasts, so I have this old G&S Board roughly 7’something, a RA Longboard, a 7S Fish, 11’6 C4 Waterman SUP, a beater longboard for my TN buddies I convince to go with me and I believe that pretty much rounds it out. I spend a fair amount of time from the Coast of New York down to Sebastin Inlet and have been to Southern California 2x last year and Norhtern California once. Am planning on headind down to Panama next year and hitting up the coast of Oregon this year if I can make it happen. I try to get around…

SammyA…I can’t seem to get the pics uploaded, fell like helping me out? Maybe a explanation of how to…the files are pretty big. Sorry for being a newbie.


resizing options are available inline within the upload form.

click the tree icon above the reply text area and past in the “Direct” URL from imageshack.

To upload the photos-

  1. Make an account on

  2. Upload your pictures to TinyPic.

  3. Open BOTH TinyPic and Swaylocks.

  4. On TinyPic select the picture you want to upload. To the left of the picture are a few URL codes. Copy the “IMG CODE FOR FORUMS…”.

  5. Go back to Swaylocks and click “reply” to the thread. In the response box click on the picture of a tree in white box. Its just above the text box, second from the right on the toolbar. A small dialogue box will open.

  6. Paste the IMG code from TinyPics in the “Image URL” box.

  7. IMPORTANT- deleate the at the end of the URL.

  8. Click 'Insert" at the bottom of the dialogue box. The picture should appear.

  9. You might need to resize the picture again. Just click on the corner of the pic and adjust it so it fits in the text box.

It’s not as complicated as it sounds. Im sure there are other ways but this worked just fine for me and im pretty computer illiterate…Enjoy.

Ok guys here we go…

Hows that? Pretty good and easy…thanks yankeesurfer, alright guys now for everyone’s expertise.


Here is a pic of the top of the board’s tail, its a pintail shape. It is rough with not so great ding repair. As I said my buddy got 2nd or 3rd hand or more on a trade many years ago. We are patching it up and wet sanding some of the bad glass jobs that have been to it, but all in all it looks to be a great board, if it is a 72 model it is older than I am and I am stoked about that. I don’t think it will ever look as great as it has in the past, but I feel a little closer to what surfing roots I have thru older friends and people that have been in the industry for thier whole lives. I will try to get some pics of the nose, it looks like a fish nose, some rocker, not a lot and wide and not shortboard pointy. I would guess the board was some where arounf 7’+ length although it has had some really bad nose repairs and we are fixing it right now.

I’ve been using tinypic for years, without an account. Can’t see why you’d need to do so.

As to re-sizing…tinypic re-sizes anything that’s overly large, automatically.

Doesn’t help much. Nor do the rest of the pics. How about photos of the entire board? Top and bottom.

So far, all we know is that it’s a G and S, and the rails are red with blue pinlines. Could be anything from 1970 to 1990. Does it have a fin box? That helps with dating early shortboards. A picture of that would help, if there is a box.

I’m going to go out on a limb and guess that the ‘72’ after the serial # is the length. Did you bother to measure it?

That’s my guess. I don’t remember anyone writing the year on any of the boards. It was common to write the length though.

As SammyA says, the pictures you’ve posted aren’t much help.

OOO AAAAH … thats Hastings magenta color!!! Yes that is about circa 72. Show the whole thing and I’ll tell you more. Probably a Paul B shape … he shaped tons of those about that time. Redwood stringer. Show us more.


Of course … I actually couldn’t remember how to spell it. Thanks.

Yea Bill I’ll bet it’s a 7’2" but I wouldn’t be surprised if it’s also from 72. Wavecraft foam … ? You think? I’d like to see the fin box … that might help date it huh? And the whole outline would too. The number is in the 300’s so that was from early in whatever year it was.

Yes, I’m sure that’s Paul Bordieri’s handwriting on the serial number. I’d recognize it anywhere. (ha)

You’re right I’ll bet it is a 7’2 from '72. Of course it’s hard to tell much from the serial #. Palm Printing in PB printed the order cards and the serial #'s were consectutive but each order started with a random #. We never thought it was that important for future collectors to identify the year.

Without seeing the fin box I can tell you that it’s a Bahne/Fins Unlimited. Prior to that were our own boxes and prior to that were w.a.v.e. set boxes.

The return of the rectangle logo was about '72 or so. In '70-'71 there was an outline typestyled “Gordon & Smith” and in "69 was the Magic coat of arms and the Hot Curl flower band.

Cool…I never woul dhave thought this would have been so much fun. I didn’t get a chance to get over there tonite so it will all have to wait until tommorrow. Thanks everyone for your help. I will get pics of the whole board and the fin box. As to the measuring of the board it has a severly damaged nose and we are int he process of fixing it. I will get photo’s of the multi colored rainbow fin as well, but it will all have to wait until tommorrow. I promise to get the pics up tommorrow. I will swing by there 1st thing in the morning and try and have them up by lunch or so. Again thanks to everyone, I just did not know what I had and from the sound of it maybe I still don’t, but we are getting ever so close. I am super stoked to have an old board that maybe I can get some nice rides out of…I still think its cool that if its a 72 model its 4 years older than I am . Gives you a different kind of stoke. If that thing could tell us where all it has been and how it wound up in my buddies attic in Chattanooga, TN…what a story that may be.

Thanks and talk to you all tommorrow,


Did G&S do any of the Guidance boxes? I had a Weber with one about 68 - 69 and I know a bunch of manufacturers jumped in. I thought G&S was one but I don’t remember. I got a G&S about a year later and for the life of me I can’t remember what system it had. Probably a FU … I guess? I do like the bottom color. Hastings had the cleanest tints … beautiful. That magenta they had looked like candy.

Yes. I remember getting a Magic shipped to me in the middle of my 1969 Summer promotional tour. It had the new Guidance System.

Here's an exerpt from another thread (Con Auzzie) where a similar conversation is going on:

"The Guidance System was developed by the members of the Surfboard Manufacturers Association. The major brands didn't like the idea of buying fin systems from their own competitors (Morey/Pope w.a.v.e. set, Bill Bahne Fins Unlimited) so they contracted to have their own system designed and manufactured. It was a short lived venture. When Bill Bahne/Fins Unlimited came out with his system which went back to a fiberglass fin, instead of the plastic fins in the other systems, he took over the market."

and "By '70, at G&S we were using our own system

designed by Larry Gordon. It had a fiberglass fin and was introduced in an ad
which said “Narrow Boards and Glass Fins”. We had a couple of
problems. One was interchangeability. The other was how to keep the fin from
falling out. Bill Bahne was working on a similar system and he solved the two
problems. We switched to his Fins Unlimited system but not until we’d shipped a
few boards with our system which became a problem for me as I traveled from
dealer to dealer trying to get the fins to fit."

Here’s a funny story about that: For the w.a.v.e set system, each manufacturer had designed their own fin. Larry Gordon’s fin was the most popular. I remember him designing the plug getting the curve just right and sanding that thing and getting it foiled the way he wanted it. It did look good. Shops were ordering boards from other manufacturers and requesting the G&S fin. When the manufacturers association put together the Guidance System one of the issues was they had been buying the finboxes from their competitors and the other was they were buying the fins designed by another competitor.

They forgot the initials for the Guidance System was GS. There was more than one comment at one of the SMA meetings.

Anyway, the move away from the polypropolene fins which were way too flexible and the lexan replacements which broke too easily was swift with the invention of the removeable fiberglass fin.

The original copy for the ad above had some pretty disparaging comments about the plastic fins and I cautioned Larry that we had a lot of boards (thousands) that we’d sold with those fins and boxes and that we had to be careful not to talk down our own product in the ad. The average customer only knew that their board was a G&S they didn’t necessarily understand the the fin boxes had come from another supplier and even if they did, we were the ones that had installed them and manufactured and sold the final product.

Skip Frye had designed a series of fins for w.a.v.e set and he had a gym bag full of sanded fins that he would switch around in his boards. I remember him returning from his first session on a board with the newly designed removeable fiberglass fin. He took the gym bag full of w.a.v.e. set fins and threw it in the trash can in front of the PB Surf Shop.

I remember looking at that bag laying in the trash can. I thought, briefly, about pulling it out and saving it for posterity. But I was mostly living in a van at the time. I really didn’t have room for the collection. Can you imagine what that would go for at one of the collector’s auctions or on ebay today?

Ok, can the mods tell me what “Normal O” means at the beginning of my post. It’s not on the preview and I can’t edit it out.

Alright guys here’s a few more photos…one of the after market fin and one of the fin box, not really a close up. I spoke with my buddy who has the board in his garage for repair and he is going to pull measurements and post a few more pics. Below is what I have.

So awesome to see so much info and people involved with the shape are around.

Im the guy that gave the board to Adam.

The box is plastic and fin is glass.

Here are some more pics.

I am helping him patch it up from falling out of the back of the car onto the concrete last year.

Adam was hoping to color to match the patch to the board. The only pigment I have available is a standard red resin pigment. If this board is a special piece of history it seems like it would be worth the effort to try to color match as close as possible. Any ideas on matching the rosy darker colored pigment?