I’ve only installed probox so far. Post glass is nice but I really like the futures finboxes and the idea of pre glass. Any input. ??? Mostly do quads
BB30 is correct about probox installation. For quads probox can present installation issues. I use a setup which has the boxes close, so I had to cut 2 sets of jigs or else I can only install one set of boxes then I have to sand it down before installing the second set. Having lots of the jigs allows for customizing them and that makes it easier to install multiple boxes closer.
The probox system is pretty simple to get wired, and if you add the extra glass inside the routed hole, they are strong even in light eps. But someone here posted something about the extra weight of boxes versus glass ons, so that may be an issue for some. I think the futures system may end up lighter.
I have not tried futures, but I do like that they are under the initial lam and that should be stronger. With all the adjustments probox offers, I think they have an advantage post installation. I also like the way Hanalei fin tabs are designed, they are very strong.
If I buy a board from someone else, I’d just get what they put in including the fins they choose.
BB30 has done boards for me and I respect his opinion very much. I doubt there are many that are as efficient at building boards as he is. I also doubt that there are many boards stronger than the ones he’s made for my brother and me. You can punch them and they won’t have a pressure ding at all.
$200 install kit. Don’t invest in it if you don’t plan on using it. Or make your own jig. If you like probox why change ? If it ain’t broken don’t fix it.
You definately have a point on that. I like the styling and color options of futures. But I also like that pro box is fcs compatable. I would be nervous to knick the blank during install though.
It is a personal preference. I bet I could router out 5 futures boards to your 1 probox board. I could set fins boxes in foam in a 3 to 1 ratio too and final sand and prep for gloss coat at a 7 to 1 ratio.
I personally don’t like proboxes. Also when doing quads, depending on your fin placement, you will need to angle cut your probox jigs to be able to do all 4 fins at one go.
aloha
Thank you. Never really took speed into consideration. Maybe I’ll invest. I need a new router anyway.
Nah - probox is better.
With Proboxes, I lam/fill coat the board, then route the boxes. It takes about 10 minutes to glue the jigs and then route the boxes (letting the glue go for about 2 min). Then once the resin is hard, I use a belt sander to knock the boxes/resin down close to the fill coat (maybe 10 min) and then just sand it smooth into the initial sand… Way simple.
But what do I know – just a backyard hack.
Well, I’m a garage hack myself trying to get the most professional looking results!! Thanks for the tips. Enjoy man! Thanks
If better means one or more extra steps, you are right!! Do you tape the fin placement area off then spray the glue or glue to the finberglass directly?? If the second is true, does your sanding pad gum up quicly? I guess you could buy the probox post placement router jig to knock down the probox lip so you don’t over heat with the sander.
probox is better?
Finished product is WAY better IMHO.
Futures? Not even close.
They are last on the list. Again, IMHO.
Problems I have with Futures, firstly the jig is not secured the board. Secondly you’re then supposed to run a router across an unsecured jig.
You’re also supposed to adjust the depth of the routers plunge with the use of your thumb and forefinger with the Futures install kit. This is also while running a router across an unsecured jig.
Probox also accepts FCS. Futures doesn’t. No dummy fins are required while waiting for the boxes to set with Probox either. This alone makes installing fin boxes far easier for me.
No tilting the box only to push air bubbles into the resin, to be followed by lower side of the box sitting below the level of the foam (resin getting into the box). Went through this problem with another fin system.
Since I started using Proboxes all these problems went away. Oh yeah, how much are FCS H2 fins compared to fibreglass Probox fins? Like wise for a top of the mill Futures fin. Way more and they’re not foiled as well either.
Probox bases and Probox fins (or Hanalei fins) feel real solid as well. Like glass ons. And you can adjust them after installation. Futures bases and fins you can’t.
All the problems you mention are news to me with futures. Are you sure you are thinking of the futures system? If you have problems holding a non skid jig with one hand and a small laminate router with the other, you possibly could have a problem doing this as pictured below.
Anyone have any experience installing FCS? How does it compare to probox or futures??
Fusions is real easy to route
but with greater curvatures, you also need to pay attention to the depth
as in - you always need to pay attention
probox can look better, only if the insert matches the cant angle you need AND the color of your board
futures does not accepte greg griffin custom fin, nor robin mair custom fins
probox is a bit of work yes, but, better than 4wfs in my opinion
why? it accepts fcs for starters! and, you go crazy over ALL the options on 4wfs + they proly dont have a good rep in us
pre-glass is sometimes a bit hard, because you want a no bubble install. and with glass going over the boxes… you get bubbles you need to get rid of
working with epoxy or poly makes a difference too, poly stends to -stick- better than epoxy, less bubbles…
for strength, ease of use, i still think fusion is the best, just personal preference
my latest will get probox cause robin mair made me custom set of G10 quad fins!! yeaha
so, let us know what type of construction you use and how many boards you build and your budget
cheers [which does have a gay tast to it now thanks to sanolocalho]
ProBox
Holding a jig down with one hand while holding a power tool in the other while also adjusting the plunge with your thumb and fore finger with that same hand is not what I call ideal.
Also you can’t really tape the jig down with pre glass fin boxes or you risk marking the foam. Apart from that, I don’t have an issue with Futures boxes or fins, just the install process of them bugs me a bit is all.
Thanks all for the responses!! Think I’m gonna stick with probox for now. There is a set of FCS fins I like for a quad setup. I’m 200+ so a bigger fin would be nice on the 5’10" I’m starting.
Dean,
I still don’t have those problems you mention. Marking the foam…just be careful. Plunge depth…Always set router depth latch open and it acheives max depth automatically with futures jigs/adapters. I only apply pressure to the top to insure max depth is cut. The initial poster does quads so no stringer usually involved.
Also the posted question was about installation. Which is easier??? Ask a piece work glasser or fin guy which is easier?? Making way less money per hour on probox unless they charge more for that install.
Which is a better system for function is a different story. Personal preference I’d say. Probox has been available for many years now. What is their market share compared to futures and FCS?? I think it is inheriently complicated with install and all those pieces to loose. But if the customer wants them I hope you are charging more for the extra time you spend on the installs.
Check this probox set up below. I think it would take 5 to 10 times longer than an equivelant futures or fusion install.
Dean,
I forgot to mention that with my techniques, futures boxes are way quicker to install, and way stronger , and way more beautiful than any fin box system out there.
It is called a triple threat in the industry.
aloha
Points noted. Cheers!