no more posts
there are private efforts to resolve this dispute.
thanks
Perspective, gents.
It’s about what you want to surf, and what you enjoy surfing.
So, design requirements.
Lighter is great for some, as is smaller. Heavier and/or bigger is the go for some too.
Ride it all. It’s fun!
(Just my 2c, as usual).
True to form doug. When we lose sight of the fun inherent in surfing, it becomes a sport like any other. How many other sports are there with so much diversity of equipment, all just as valid as the next, as long as it is FUN. I need to go surf, these winds are killing me.
yeah lighten up
your heavy boards
they are waaaaay
overrated
I realize I’m probably throwing poo poo at the fan, but isn’t easier to make a board heavier? Just add another layer of glass or a thicker layer of wood. But when you’re pushing the envelope of light it really becomes a game of finesse and hi-tech.
OK. There goes the poo poo. Let’s see where it goes.
Uuummm… Not necessarily. With compsand it’s a different story. We can make an indestructable board (ok, not quite. but nearly).
Is this thread some old bone that was buried a while back and then dug up again ?
If so can I dig up a few too ?? 
So many people underrate heavy boards . . . . whereas nearly all people (surfer’s and non surfers) assume that lighter is better automatically, that’s what they have been taught.
So although the ideal weight of a board depends upon how you want the board to ride, and heavier and lighter are not ‘better’ than each other in themselves, there is a mass assumption that lighter is better, and thus heavier boards are, all things considered, underrated.
so if heavy boards are underrated does that make light boards overrated ?
Not sure, probably not.
Quote:
I realize I’m probably throwing poo poo at the fan, but isn’t easier to make a board heavier? Just add another layer of glass or a thicker layer of wood. But when you’re pushing the envelope of light it really becomes a game of finesse and hi-tech.
OK. There goes the poo poo. Let’s see where it goes.
What’s ease of construction got to do with it anyway ?
Isn’t it how they ride that counts ?
Isn’t it how they ride that counts?
That’s the point. All designs are good and valid (assuming they function).
The only bad board in the water is one that’s being ridden by someone with a shitty attitude.
Maybe we should say “There are no bad boards, just bad riders”.
I quite often surf in windy/choppy conditions (east vancouver island windswell) and find a lightweight board gets thrown around. I prefer the extra heft and believe it improves my surfing performance in these conditions ( 6 feet and blowing onshore up to 40 knots).
It’s good to put in a little weight when conditions are choppy. But where you put the weight should be considered. Do you want it in the middle of the board, or around the perimeter? Something to think about.
Doug,
Please… attitude aside, there are plenty of bad boards out there. Your comment is well founded in kindness, but not in reality. There is a point of diminishing return in both lightness, and weight. Too much of either one can work against you. It is a highly subjective topic. How much is too much? How little is too little? Depends,eh?
Quote:
[b][i]BTW, heavy, hollow, wooden longboards are way overrated.
Do you see how rediculous both these statements are PJ?
Overrated according to whom?
How much more BIASED can one be?
Did Tom Blake (your hero?) think lighter boards were overrated?
Am I sensing anger...???...
It reads that way...
If you were offended by my opinion, you might have to just lighten up a bit...
It's only words...
In the thread that you pulled that quote from, I was just offering a personal opinion based on my experience of riding lots of boards for lots of years...
My opinion is based on my 30+ years of wave riding experience and witnessing other's frustrations attempting to ride "this year's model"...
In particular, my opinion on board weight is based on comparing nearly identical shapes, one in foam, one in hollow wood...
The primary difference between the two is about 15#, the foam board being lighter...
I like the heavier board way better for these reasons:
- The heavier board catches waves easier...To me a good thing.
- The heavier board drops in a lot easier on the heavy offshore days which I prefer...
- The heavier board is a lot more solid on the face of the wave...Less chatter..
- The heavier board glides better on and through the wave...
- The heavier board requires more skill to ride well...
- The heavier board is different, and I really like being different... __________________________________________________
I don't see being biased as a bad thing...???...If it's based on experience...
Tom Blake was a genius...
One of the true pioneers...
But, not one of my heros...
My heros are people I know...
I'm not sure whereTom Blake would stand on this topic...???...
Quote:
I was gonna ask you politely to rephrase, but please allow me to do it for you:
“BTW, dont count out a heavier board. For some surfers, given certain style and conditions, particularly overhead, may work much better for you, and you might really like how it feels”
Wow, you said it perfectly...
Here's a peek into my reality...
Given these conditions, I'll stand by my original statement...
Paul - A Moderator with an opinion...
Nicely said, Paul…
I have a really hard time with how this thread seems to assume we each need to pick a side & stick with it. Polarization, don’t we get enough of it in politics?
I want some heavy boards and some light ones. Different conditions, spots, moods… Neither is right or wrong. I have 10’ longboards that weigh 16# and others that weigh closer to 30#…
But I usually paddle out something about 20-21# - compromise being that lost art in politics, but hopefully not in surfboards, just yet
First thing first.
I would have gone PM with this but PJ didnt respond to my last one so here we are.
There are opinions like this little uplifting jewel
http://www.swaylocks.com/forum/gforum.cgi?post=228585#228585
and then there’s propaganda motivated by “fill-in-the-blank”
LP had a clearly defined design goal, to make a wooden hollow composite as light as possible. Its clear to me that LP knows exactly what he wants surfing weak FL waves.
Yet you chime in with your heavy board propaganda w/o even the slightest complimentary thing to say about his efforts and thread. The you proceed to talk about the virtues of your boards.
YOU must be really special Paul.
And what IS your motivation? Sales?
And here you are doing it again with your surf photos. Well you must be the luckiest surfer on earth surfing waves like that year round.
Thats really gonna help LP in Tampa Bay redefine his design goals next time around…BIG EPIC WAVES…YEAH GO HEAVY. Thatll work well here in Tampa. Ok got it, thanks PJ youre the best.
(Sorry Benny, propaganda serves no purpose other than to divide, just as you stated. I think youre only seeing one side of the story. You must be really enamoured by PJs work product to take sides).
Fact of the matter is, PJ likes to throw first punches.
Thats ok…he has every right to his opinion.
I just find it real interesting that PJ is a “moderator”…
well PJ, please start by moderating your extreme bias,
like my rephrasing…we dont have to love each other like blood brothers,
but we can agree that the rephrase is a better way to go around here?
Right?
PS - you had every opportunity to edit out your negativity…even after the PM…you chose not to.
No, not angry.
Disappointed is more like it.
Quote:
(Sorry Benny, propaganda serves no purpose other than to divide, just as you stated. I think youre only seeing one side of the story. You must be really enamoured by PJs work product to take sides).
If it wasn’t clear, Mee, I wasn’t taking sides at all. I’m disappointed in anyone - including everyone in this thread - who says their point of view is all to one side OR the other.
Personally, I wouldn’t like a 35# board any more than I’d like a 12# one (assuming my basic 10’ range). But, extremes aside, I’m all for choices for myself, and wouldn’t even begrudge anyone else those 35# or 12# options if they liked 'em.
That doesn’t mean I won’t defend the merits of my own preferences…but I would always (try) to do it in a way that actually presented the desirable features, rather than criticising another’s preference.
I can freely admit to being an admirer of Paul’s craftsmanship and innovation. I can also freely admit I’m not going to make one myself, because I don’t care for heavy stiff boards like he does. (More about the stiff than the heavy.)
But you know what? I can say the same about you. I admire your craftsmanship and innovation just as much. And I’m also not interested in building the lightest, flexiest, bottom-skinless board I can, because I just enjoy surfing in a different style.
So don’t drag me into this, man
Ben, im not blaming you for anything inherintly bad, i was just trying to make a point…valid or invalid.
Didnt mean to offend.
Beautiful waves Paul.
Have you all seen the movie “Wedding Crasher’s??”
As they say in the movie, “Lock it Up”
As for my opinion, its mine. I like light boards, probably because I ride sub 6 foot shortboards in typical FL mush. The lighter, the better. I got hit with a runaway longboard the other day in the ankle(it chased me down, i swear it was laser guided) and my ankle is swollen and bloody. I wish that one was one of bennys light one’s because maybe i could walk today if it was.
BUT, some people prefer a heavy board, That is fine with me (as long as it doesn’t hit me in the ankle) For waves like the ones in the picture, a heavier board might be beneficial. I say might because I have never seen a wave like that…
As far as some of the other comments, there is nothing wrong with setting a design goal for a light board, if that is what you want to do. If you want a heavy board, than design it to be heavy…
Well, I am off to go fill coat my latest 5.25 lb shortboard. It probably won’t even trim nice, wink wink…
Scott