[quote="$1"]
huck,your not suggesting understanding rocker using numerical data against ride reports is unethical.?.
[/quote]
huh? I was responding to sharkcountry, I was careful to include a quote to show what I was responding to, have no idea where you came up with that????
I like this post Ambrose… Thanks… I think I know exactly what you’re saying… Yet I don’t have a clue what you’re really thinking… Cool…
Or was that the other way round??? Hell , now I’m confused…")
Success has been clinically proven to enhance your life… Call 1 800 *** **** to order today…
yes Ambrose,you know how to finish a tale…classic!
Bill,many thanks,i cant help agreeing with much you say
its certainly not all about rocker
Knowing how to blend a near infinite amount of unique features into combinations that constantly perform above expectation
my concern is the mass producers are rolling the numbers right now,with lots of feedback
magic boards may become standard
will the next generation of handshapers be going up against the machine
without an overall understanding of rocker?
maybe…
A good rocker is like a wing in an up draft!
yes-no! ?
Bill,
I concur. I surf good enough to know what I wanted, but did not communicate well enough to convey the ideas to my shapers. Started designing my own and it’s taken me good places, so I built a machine I could use to reproduce and experiment.
It would be interesting, though, to see whether the lowest 1/3 of the “best” rockers are the same.
PS I prefer my own rockers over any other, so I don’t really care, but knowing what comprises a good “engine” would help many aspiring shapers and designers.
My rockers come in to the low point really slowly and exit really slowly, but there is no flat spot. Draw a big enough circle and take a piece and make that the middle 1/3 of the rocker, then blend to nose and tail numbers. Or just look up “lofting”.
I guess by now most of u will have seen the design centre of a forward thinking mass producer, having a look at the custom market,and revelling in how easy its going to be…
I’d like to see handshapers to retain more than is likely,
can we do anything,collectively…
if you can shake your personal fears,then some honest opinion would make refreshing reading…
–Dyings easy,it’s living thats hard… josey wales–
Apologies,in my last post you need to add ‘being able’ after handshapers,then it works…
swaylock,you could put some minds at rest here,if you’d catagorically state you will not put a 3-d design program on this design site,and it will never be linked to common board statistics and associated data…
to think outside the box
first you have to build a box
then convince a bunch of guys
to get in the box …
after a while when they say
" hey we are in a box!"
then You can begin to think
outside the box.
associated data box…?
join the association of
surfboard manufacturers.
swaylox,is a symptom
of “Hey we are in a box!”
…ambrose…
swaylocks is the curative
until it is the disease.
Thanks ambrose,for helping me open the can…
swaylock,if your still undecided,think about calling it ‘swayfever’
something thats got a grip of most of us here
and kinda catchy…)
Some things are worth repeating, and I think this is. You guys should study this and the wisdom it provides; if you get checked at the door, think about why.
NUTSHELL:
"Look at the rocker
and think like you are the water".
A. M. Curry III
A pearl from the pool of wisdom.
'Nuff said.
I don't use data bases, don't use aku or any other shaping program, don't use cnc, etc etc. I'm as low-tech as they come, drawing my boards on graph paper and buildng them mostly stick by stick from scraps of wood in my little 9 x 14 shack in my backyard. So I don't have a need for any such data base.
But I don't see any ideological objection to such a data base - if anything, I think it would be healthy and helpful to bring the subject of rocker variations out of the closet and into the light of day, as it were.
Swaylocks is mostly a do-it-yourself'er environment of guys who build boards the hard way, sharing info and encouragement to help one another - and a collection of rocker variations seems fully in line with that concept. Its been said repeatedly that rocker in itself is no magic fairy dust, just another factor in the overall equation, so I don't see it as a monumental shift in any particular direction anyway.
The industry is going to go where it goes, and do what it does, regardless of what we here at swaylocks do. It has already shown the direction it wants to go, i.e. computerized designs built by computer-numeric machines and glassed / finished at third-world-labor prices, imported and heavily advertised / promoted to the masses.
For backyarders to share data is IMO actually a bulwark against the industry computerized mechanization taking over the whole shebang - the better boards that we garage hacks can build, the more interest and legitimacy we gain, and the more fun we have!
Maybe its just me, but I just don't see crowded surf, or any other real problems, resulting from home builders sharing info. Heck, even industry pro's are publishing things like templates, board dimensions, volume, design rationale, and fin placement info on the internet.
Thanx rat,Bills words are always welcome on here,i hope he has time to bring further insight to this complex and evolving problem,i can understand his feeling and agree entirely,nobody wants to give a leg up to the unscrupulous and unworthy,out for fame and a fast buck…fortunately,i think most of u are here for the long haul,and when it comes…the big squeeze…being better prepared will be the key…
shortly more controversy,the ownership of shapes in a block of foam…
Huck,thanks for standing up,and out,i doubt i’ll need it either…but its a principle worth fighting for…
Oops,can i retract that last comment
i will need it
i would use it for reference purposes
i will learn to become computer literate
and i do want the ability to conduct business online…
Make some boards ride them and measure them, you bunch of lazy tards. Put some time in a stop acting like babies.
correct me if i’m wrong but looking at the patent office and registered designs,it becomes apparent that any surfboard shape coming out of a block of foam is common property. the pre conditions for applying,the proof of originality,and proof of meaningful infringement have made ownership of surf shapes impossible.i cant find any successful cases relating to our field
upside,freedom…anyone can go in to a block of foam and make anything they want,and use any measurements they like
downside,we dont even actually own our own rockers…
in that case the only wrong going on at the moment, is perceived ownership,…
anyone like to add more regarding this… ?
I wanna be an archer.
I wanna shoot arrows that hit the bulls-eye on the target
but I feel like such a failure I have spurted out three arrows
at the sun and they have all fallen back to earth.
If I only could construct a long tube like a pipe
to shoot the arrow in that went from my arrow
to the sun assureing a bullseye hit I would feel like a god.
You know what I mean,dont you wanna feel like a god?
…ambrose…
I have a guide book to get me
to every bus stop in the neighborhood.
now I have to over come two obstacles
blindness and no shoes. Then I can go
Downtown where all the cool stuff is.
gettorat,i see why you post other peoples words…there much stronger…
With all the complex bottoms and fin layouts these days, I don't see the usefulness of a rocker catalogue other than for ordering blanks. The curve changes immediately when the concave(s) or "vee" or any other feature is cut in. There would have to be a very complex system of reference points in which to measure dealing with all different contours. Not to mention the "crazy" (meaning interesting) stuff that guys like Surffoils and Herb et.al. have experimented with. Just a hack's point of view.
[quote="$1"] With all the complex bottoms and fin layouts these days, I don't see the usefulness of a rocker catalogue other than for ordering blanks... [/quote]
Exactly, that's a good illustration - its a communication tool. You know the rocker you have in mind, but how do you communicate that? A rocker catalog gives you the ability to identify which rocker configuration you are specifying. That's why blank catalogs typically do feature rocker diagrams and dimensions.
I don't think of rocker as a magic bullet or some kind of secret sauce that will make all your arrows hit the sun, its just another design factor, like template, fin placement, or any other ingredient. You can bet that industry professionals use design factors in their boards that others have worked out before them, not cuz they're lazy tards, but because that's common sense. We all learn from each other, no crime in that.
The pixie dust is in getting just the right mix of all the ingredients, and that will always be the realm of the talented shapers who have paid their dues. Once that recipe is developed, then machines and computers can replicate it, but only the master chef can put it together from scratch.