Political discussions too quickly drift into personal attacks. You are welcome to discuss this with me with Personal Messages. Gentlemen, thank you fer yer attention…
lee that was so well done …
i thought that post would have killed the thread …
thats what makes sways as good as it is …
regards
BERT
no, it’s more an offshoot of the stinger. It’s called the stinker.
Hey Bert
it’s been inferred that you and Nev were building boards for Kelly with your postings concerning the Huntington show, but now I read this in that fortune mag article about French posted in the news section of sways…
Quote:
Two recent developments should help Surftech’s image. Earlier this year six-time world champion Kelly Slater lent his name to a series of Surftech boards. Slater, one of the most famous surfers in the world, has publicly expressed frustration with the fragility of polyurethane boards (he once broke three in a session in Indonesia), though he still rides them in contests. Perhaps more important, a top professional surfer recently used a Surftech board in competition. At the 2004 Quicksilver Pro contest in Australia, former world champion Sunny Garcia became the first pro to win a heat on a Surftech. He didn’t win the event, but the surf press and online chat groups took note of his equipment.
At a recent trade show in San Diego, the Surftech booth was a hive of activity. The company introduced four new Kelly Slater signature models (different sizes for taller or shorter surfers, and for varying wave conditions) based on masters produced by Al Merrick, Surfing magazine’s shaper of the year. There was also Robert August, star of the 1960s movie Endless Summer, who has models in the Surftech line. In the middle of it all, French moved easily among the celebrities of the surf world and the potential customers who asked him about the boards.
When asked what he’s proudest of, French doesn’t hesitate. “Last year we paid out a million dollars in royalties,” he says. “Before Surftech, the pioneers of surfboard shaping had to be chained to their sheds to make any money. And shaping boards is hard work. Now these guys have something of a golden parachute, and surfers get to enjoy the legacy of their perfected shapes.” If that makes French the most controversial person in the sport, he can deal with it.
So what gives?
Is Slater going the way of the ultra stiffy epoxy otherwise know as surftech?
Or is he a proponent of this new flex epoxy school?
Seems like he’s siding with what French is saying an epoxy board should ride like…
I just find it strange that once someone like him rode one of your designs that he would choose to go the way of surftech instead… But then again it’s about alliances to Merrick I guess…
Its just find it strange that with all the options out there… Halun, Aviso, XTR, HydroEpic, Surfgear Hawaii, and Nev SurfBurger, he would choose to have a Surftech line of Slater branded epoxies…
Has Randy’s regime already gotten to the point that there just isn’t any other choice to make in the name of brand and production capability? Sometimes things kind of go like that, where you just don’t have a choice anymore because no one can produce the units required to supply the demand that will be driven off your “name brand” recognition sales… Who knows maybe Curren’s “Black Beauty” and Machado’s Single fin are the next designs to get scanned by surftech…
It’s an interesting problem… supply versus demand driven by brand recognition
Just like oil, the chinese, bad weather, and the affect on gas in the US… Supply versus demand
No biggies just an outsider who doesn’t understand why someone like Kelly wouldn’t “see the light” when exposed to the Burger Snap Virus…
Quote:
Is Slater going the way of the ultra stiffy epoxy otherwise know as surftech?
Or is he a proponent of this new flex epoxy school?
Funny, I’ve see a couple of interviews and read a couple more where Kelly Slater clearly stated that flex would be the next major breakthrough in board design. regards, Håvard
Hmmm…
Interesting, but you got to give me more to work with. I knew a mis-labeled picture, would bring “The Plan” to light, cause for sure cocks like to crow about how they own the world, remember, “I’m the king of the world?” You’re a freakin movie maker. Humility? Not an ego maniacs strong suit.
There is quite a difference between passion for your craft and a GLORY HOG.
Assembly line or machine or foreign or slave labor, that’s what we are fighting here, also those that want to sell their name or hand the plans over for a stipend that will make their retirement that cushy couch dream sleep.
The users have a different take on this, of course, cause they want their’s now, gimme, gimme, gimme. What dock do I meet that Chinese supplier at? Or what e-bay store has got dibs on the container that will quell my addiction?
Yeah, we’ve been sold a boatload again and it takes money to make money and on and on. So start up the threads again, you know - the circle-jerk one’s that are ever so popular with the “addicted” set. But I’m not gonna lose any sleep this time cause I’m open to the people that are going to bring the change, and God grant me the freakin patience so I don’t open the wrong box again and get lulled into that comfort zone where even though the view is just slightly askew it’s still band-aid tolerable.
FAITH. The Christians have been waiting a couple of thousand years and counting, the buddhists got ONE glimpse of how it could be and thank God we aren’t an endangered species cause, swat, oh well! Easy come easy go… It’s just surfing fer chrisake!
Adam and the Ants said it best.
you may not like
the things we do
only idiots
ignore the truth
it’s easy to
lay down and hide
where’s the warrior
without his pride?
we’re gonna move real good - yeah right
we’re gonna dress so fine - OK
it’s
dog eat dog eat dog eat dog
eat dog eat dog eat dog eat dog
leapfrog the dog
and brush me daddy-O
it’s easy to
lay down and hide
where’s the warrior
without his pride?
you may not like
the things we say
what’s the difference
anyway?
we’re gonna move real good - yeah right
we’re gonna dress so fine - OK
it’s
dog eat dog eat dog eat dog
eat dog eat dog eat dog eat dog
leapfrog the dog
and brush me daddy-O
it makes me proud
so proud of you
I see innocence
shining through
(repeat til end)
Yeah that what I thought
But I think it would just kill things to have Slater then doing one of those giant two page media ads like Dorian’s doing for JC or Poncho’s doing for Bushman for Surftech… Maybe it’s good… At least Curren did his Point Blanks blue XPS foam experiments too bad he didn’t stick with it… Biolos and Lost are making a statement with their Aviso’s and I don’t know what to think about Brewer and Walden since their lining up with both Hydroepic carbon shelled hollows as well as with Surftech and Boardworks… I wish I could see these in competition though…
I was kind of hoping we finally found a valid high profile pro willing to speak up for wood sandwich-flex technology.
I guess just to be willing to put your name behind something that not PU/PE is a big step for a name as big as Slater and we should be greatful… Now if more of them would actually compete with them like Sunny that would be something… Of course I’m sure Sunny viewed using his Surftech Merrick Flyer to offset his weight in junky surf as an advantage. He used to ride those Australian Bamboo epoxies that Gary Young help start and dumped it which is too bad… I would’ve rather seen them both be competing and advocating wooden, flexing epoxies. But something is better than nothing… It’s a small but good start for a change towards better technology, I just hopes they stick it out and aren’t in it just for the millions in commissions from Surftech that goes to their shaper…
Maybe that should be the rule…
If you put your name on something, you should at least back it up by using it when you compete to make your living …
One day before I die, I would love a bunch of these boards competing with the top 44…
Top Pro’s invest their entire live’s in making their names worth something. And, while they may want to help promote a product that they believe should improve performance. Unless they are pretty much guaranteed a significant pay check. They may express a passing interest. But, they won’t really promote it till they start getting the checks. Randy can afford to write those checks today. Bert and Nev hope to be able to write those checks tomorrow. Kelly’s just going were the money is. Speaking from experience.
Innovation no longer pushes the surf industy, money does. Not only money, but following the status quo of those with the cash. Those that go against the grain are shunned and passed off as has beens.
well shock horror …
the week that the quicksilver pro was on , i was talking to randy and he said he had been talking with slater about a model …
my interpretation of that comment was , he made an offer but surely slater wouldnt take him seriously ??
guess i was wrong …
i would presume it has kelly’s approval …
there were a few other high profile shapers who released surftech models based on the designs of the pro surfers riding there boards .
but the actuall pros them selves hadnt sanctioned or approved the surftech models being released with there names attached …
there has been some really sticky situations where shapers have marketed surftechs and used pros to endorse the product because the surfer is contracted to the label …
even tho the surfer wouldnt ride one himself …
unless some of the other cases become public knowledge i wont comment further …
all i know if i take randy’s word , is that himself and slater already had dialog before he got to even ride our boards …
but solo and tom were right …
once you raise your profile as a surfer , you can cash in on branding , whether you support and recomend it for your self is another thing …
i have no details whatso ever , but i would be curious as to whether slaters contract with merrick , means kelly may not have a choice if he is tied to merrick and merrick reserves the right to use kelly for marketing purposes …
yea i think some of the regular status quo guys are right …
this whole epoxy thing will just fade and go away …
LOL …
regards
BERT
Exactly Bert,
We should all just hold our breath, shut our eyes “real tight” and it will all just go away …
I was talking with Holly last week and he was telling me that his business (snowboards) is almost purely tech driven … team riders have little impact. This is true in most sports. Do you buy you car based on who places at Daytona? Do you buy a tennis racket based on who won a grand slam event? No you buy the best based on what feedback comes from the media. Meanwhile surfing is BS driven and has been since 1981. Will this change? The media has been, in part, behind the downfall of the advance of this sport’s technological base because the powers there are afraid of rocking the boat. But that’s changing due to places like this.
I have actually had a Surfer Mag editor tell me that Surfer isn’t the forum to discuss board design … WHAT??? … WHAT??? A surf mag isn’t the right forum to discuss surfboards??? WTF is the right forum??? Why that would be Swaylocks … perhaps he was right. I guess this also means that surf mags are not the forum in which to advertise surfboards either. At least I took it that way. Haven’t advertised with one of them since.
Somehow the pros will eventually figure out what they’ve been missing and then they’ll figure a way to get money out of it. Don’t worry, they’ll ride what they want and the money will follow. The dike is leaking.
Check the CI web site, CI’s KBoard, the Kelly Slater signature model, is one of the Merrick Tuflites. This might actually backfire on Surtech - people might say " if this is better technology why is Slater still riding Al’s poly boards when he can get the same shape in a Surftech?"
a board that is sold with the endorsment of a pro surfer has never been the same as what the actual surfer would ride …
shape maybe , but never glass job …
what gets made for the consumer is more durable …
as neither surftech or merrick make custom sandwich boards , kelly’s only chance of a custom from al is a p/u , as there is no way he would want to ride the heavier moulded version …
plus you still have the issues of internal structure and how it affects the ride and performance …
on the other hand if kelly did ride sandwich boards and those boards were reproduced in a mould , that would show a certain more credible picture …
but as 90% of surfers have no concept of the details regarding surfboard construction …
its business as usual , less a few players …
because of the hard headed im not touching epoxy brigade , the market is looking elsewhere …
so a few guys get left out of the picture , its not like nobody didnt tell them …
you know its funny , i know a few guys mowing lawns , working in mines , selling houses , etc …
if they took some opportunities offered a decade back , they would still be building boards and making a profit…
as they would now be making custom versions of what people were seeking …
but they listened to industry leaders of the day , and cast off the new concepts as lunacy …
LOL …
well to all those crew who never took the offer back then , and who stuck the boot in at every opportunity …
i really have to thank , in the long run …
regards
BERT
How do we find out what to take on a surf trip besides that over-pedaled board and accessories, you know, the essentials, what really makes sense?
Where do you go to find out things for yourself about building a board that will translate the feelings you have in your heart for the sport/lifestyle that you love?
Make new friends, find someone who thinks along the same lines, broaden your scope and fall in love all over again with the salt lick, inner core, self-beliefs?
Swaylocks IS the new Surfer Magazine.
My wife says she sees more and more of those funny squarish shaped blanks going down the freeway tied to the top of cars, where are they headed? To the front lines of the revolution, your home beach break…
(repeat til end)
Returning to the source of the thread, I was lucky enough to just spend a month in J-Bay and got to meet and see Mike Meyer surf. This was what struck me from the article:
“(speaking of J-Bay) I cringe when I fall off and waste one of these rare beauties. I want to end the wave with a traditional standup pull out. Negotiating what the wave offers and riding it to its end with skill and grace is what I want from riding waves.”
When I hear this, it resonates with ME and what I want out of surfing and surfboards. Only me. The rest of this thread is kind of like arguing which color is the best color. Blue is best…naahhhh, you’re an idiot…red is obviously best, blue is so old. We’ve done blue for the thirty years. Red is best. etc, etc, etc. It’s weird when sharing detioriates to arguing, no?
How different would your surfboards and surfing be if you were the only surfer? (but I seem to remember that this has been done here before)
Take care.
(Oops, and what daddio said…I should read before I post.)
wow, alot of haters and bitterness. if slater is going the surftech route, I sense its the begining of his demise.
Change is dirty messy business.
Always has been, always will be.
That is life.
What part of the Big Bang Theory is not getting through?
Can things get any messier than taking the entire universe and compressing it to less the size of a sub atomic particle and then exploding it?
You got some old timey world class shapers talking in a pulp mag about the world as they see it, and you got some hot young forward thinking shapers talking HERE LIVE and interactive in an electronic forum discussing the magazine article and the issues presenented therein.
What is so scary and life threatening about that?
There is a new concept floating aroud the world of physics these days called negative information. In theory negative information reduces the amount of positive information remembered. As negative information increases positive information decreases. They, the physicists, are talking about particle (sub and atomic level) memory but it is particles in our heads that allow us to remember. So why bother clogging up our minds with negative memories?
http://www.damtp.cam.ac.uk/user/jono/negative-information.html
Slater has his detractors. Always has. It’s a credit to his nature that he is as stable under pressure as he is. Thus far everyone else in the world (universe) has collapsed under that kind of pressure after a max of 4 titles.
Here is something for everyone to think about regarding materials science, heat and pressure. When you get in your car next time take a glance up at the sun and realize that the iron in your car was formed there. IN the sun. Then next realize that you would not be alive sitting in it were it not for a short lived isotope of Beryllium which can only be formed in a Super Nova. It was a super Nova, which allowed the higher elements to form because iron is the highest element formed in a sun. It takes a Super Nova to create the higher elements that are necessary for life. So while our cars are made from products of a sun we are made from products of a Super Nova.
So, was our solar system exploded before? It must have.
Just some light materials physics for ya’ll:-)
Now, how significant was that epoxy v. polyester debate?
Just do it.
Think about that as you ride the waves.
Quote:
wow, alot of haters and bitterness. if slater is going the surftech route, I sense its the begining of his demise.
well thats an interesting observation big brother …
as i would have thought slater going the surftech route would instigate the demise of the status quo …
in the past as soon as a world champ rode any new design or concept , it was then seen to be publicly acceptable and no longer viewed as left of field or not to be taken seriously …
eg : mark richards , the twin fin …
simon anderson , the thruster ..
tom curren , the reverse v ..
your comment in perspective would be like saying simon riding thrusters and standing out as obtuse amongst his peers would render his demise …
slater is not stupid , this move lifts both his profile and that of surftechs …
just like both simon and the thruster , both benifited …
the fact the public are climbing over one another to buy moulded boards speaks a loud and clear message about the current status quo custom board …
regards
BERT
Bert,
Isn’t there a slight difference between Kelly having already won five world championships on pu/pe thrusters and trying to make a come back on pu/pe while endorsing a surftech model; and Simon who was trying for his first title and went out and killed the biggest Bells contest on record on a proto-type new design evolution?