maurice you are so right about epoxythe longer the post cure
the beter the goods
therin lies the problem no one wants to wait
nano tech could be dangerious particles that small they pass straight through
i am sorry this will not happen quickly in the surfboard industrie
my opinion only
huie
sorry guys I will tone down the tech spiel,my point simply was that,there are better ways of making a bd that are a lot easier,cheaper, less labour intensive and with the move to Nano Tech,vacuum bagging will hopefully become a technique? of the past!?As shapers/designers are being comercially pushed to extinction,the quest is on to try and look for new technical directions that might keep local s/bd makers in business by being able to produce superior custom s/bds!
At the moment I am trying to see if there is a place left in surfing’s comercial world, for people such as myself,and have been searching for a Tech Saviour that enhances our art,and not dilutes it to the point we are at now…decreasing, margins, market share and certainly the respect of the masses! LOcal S/bd manufacturing is now -on a steep downward spiral,but some of us keep trying,I am very trying…ask anybody who has met me!
If any body else out there is interested in the possiblity that hand laminating might replace vacuum bagging,check out the following
nanotechwire.com and look for Nanoledge/Bayer____ E.R.L(Entropy Research Labs) have started making s/bds in San Franciso!
Guys in no way did I mean to pit down vacuum bagging and its techniques…ah I’ll just shutup from now on
Firewire uses corecell, but then paint it, TL2 use the PMI (rohacell), arguably the best performing HD foam available…Just trying to track some down to try.
Hi Moonfish.
A friend here in Santa Cruz recently snapped a firewire after only a few surfs on in. I got to take a look at the foam they were using in their deck sandwich. It was about 1/16" thick, white foam. Very soft and crumbly stuff, not anything firm like corecell. Someone here said that it looked like polyurethane to them, and I would agree that it was about the same consistency as a shaving from a PU blank. This was a recent firewire.
Just relating what I saw.
Pat
I heard the same thing about the firewire deck skin being polyurethane as well.I think they did that to cut down on material cost.I have a older firewire and it has the corcell skin.It is still a great board after 15 months of abuse.
i think that vaccum bagging is very useful in some apps
but a complete waste of time in others
so you are probably right maurice
its certainly not the holy grail
hi Maurice, me again?! PLEASE DON’T SHUT UP, KEEP TALKING! The info you dropped concerning the nano tech is exactly what I was talking about, you contributed an alternative to the “old” vac bag tech. Thank you!!!
We backyarders at Sways need guys like you so we can try and emulate as best we can. A lot of us followed Bert’s path, we pick up tips from a lot of pro’s here; we would love to learn from you as well.
thanks again…looking forward to more. Now I’ll shut up 
hi pat,
i hadn’t realized they had changed the skins. but its prob a good thing… that area was always a bit concerning, spraying directly onto the corecell would be the weakest link in an otherwise strong chain. having said that i was in a surf shop on the goldy here and the were still retailing these types of boards… i knew cos if look close you can see by the rail seam a hint of yellow, but not all were like that some were painted really tight, couldn’t tell at all.
Vac bagging is old tech wrt the marine/fabrication industry, still pretty young in our world tho.
Shan
id say its more like a bad thing
they shoulda just left them unpainted
but anyway theres a way to do it without the delam prob
moon fish
rohacell what a f####kin drama that is just to talk to someone about it
you need a gold card
not to mention what the price would be me thinks i will stick to corecell
when are you moving
huie
haha, tell me about it…
really wanna get hold of some tho…
Just finished my fill coats on my latest build, its a corecell and balsa, will be posting it on the other site soon.
as matter of fact this one came about cos of the move. thought i beta get rid of most my materials b4 we pack up.
Didnt have enuf for an all balsa or corecell so it will be interesting to see how she flys.
We leave on the 8th of march, already planed a trip away with the boys when we arrive back, bought a 4/3 wettie to from kirra (1/2 price sale), thought to myself “yup gonna need that when i get to chch” lol.
Shan
vacumm technique is widely used in the skimboarding industry…nicely done sir…love your work!
I found a link to this thread at compsand.com. It’s been a long time since I’ve looked at it. A lot has happened in the four years since this was posted. I think most people making compsands got their start reading this thread. I’m one of them. Given the direction things are going I had the feeling today that this thread is really going to be a one of those important milestones in surfing/surfboard history. So I guess this is my personal ego grandizement, tacking my humble portfolio onto this significant document. I would encourage others who were inspired by this thread to get into vacuum bagging to post their creations here too.
EPS plywood fun gun- 8’-0" x 22" x 3" poplar ply, balsa/cork railed for PV Cove.
Paulownia Bonzer 5 - 6’-6" x 19-1/4" x 2-1/4"
Griffin inspired 5 fin 6’-0" x 19-1/4" x 2-1/2"
Cubera Snapper 5’-8" x 20" x 2-1/4" (2" at center with deck concave)
Yes. Huge thanks to Bert and others !
Time will tell.
now , just go do the ideas that your thinking ....
jesus why didn’t i read this before?! this has blown my mind…and its old…
all this time spent trying to perfect an outdated technology has just bitch slapped me…
thanks bert for opening my mind
I agree, great thread but I am still struggling to find what material was used to make the “contour mat”? (I haven’t seen a clear answer on this one).
Thanks!
I think a sheet of the pink or blue xps foam from the hardware store would be a good base for a contour mat,easy to shape and flexible enough to bend to the rocker table,you could get several out of a 4x8 sheet,I think a sheet runs 15-20$,if your mats were 4’ or less in length you could probably get 5-6 out of a sheet…if you split the sheet flatways from its original thickness of 3/4" into 2 pieces 4’x8’x 3/8",you could get alot of matts out of a sheet 10-12 ,the cost of each matt would be a few $. an inexpensive way to go,if they are too soft then just glass the top with epoxy.I’ve been planning contour matts for a while…I feel the need to master the flat bottom board first though!
Bert said something about obtaining contour mats by snagging the bottom contours off boards he received for repairs if he didn't already have that shaped mat already. A simple molding process using a mold release agent on the bottom of a board you like, some fiberglass cloth and resin should do the trick. Feather the edges with a grinder to minimize any transition 'step.' I think you could do it with other molding material like silicone or urethane resin as well... anything that would assume the shape and allow you to place it on your rocker surface before applying vacuum? One of the kiteboard guys around here just put a spacer under a full length acrylic sheet to obtain a basic single concave on the bottom of his boards.
My brother made one off a surtech board he likes, we used mat and glass to make it thick enough to hold the shape. Be careful, we used UV resin and that thing got so hot it messed up the board’s finish a bit.
CMP used them for his tow boards, but he also used layers of corecell and balsa under the bottom skin to make channels and bonzer type bottoms.
We use the homedepot and lowes sheet foam and with just the vacuum have been able to create the exact bottom contour of the boards we use as rocker tables. Once you have the bottom done, add the first layers of rails. With the rails on, the rocker will hold its shape and then you can profile the top and vacuum the top on.